TIE and WR treaty failure FACTS

GeIveI2aL wrote:Can I get something 100% confirmed;
Vesper you speak and is in charge of on going matters for TIE, regarding WR?

Simple yes is enough.

Why panick a population by saying the details of a murder for instance?

Sign of a good leader when the population is happy and growing.

Is the population still happy and growing? Has the leader revealed the details of the murder? Or is he still blaming it on ghosts?

Vesper is part of the shc afaik and can discuss matters on behalf of TIE.

Ones task as a Leader will be to keep calm during times of... seige.

If the leader chooses to break silence and let people decide for themselfs, people would stir but ultimately respect the leader.

Whole Republic/democratic goverment bla blah blah

Oh what does 'shc afaik' mean? (little confusing)

s= squad/secret, etc. (not sure)
hc = high command

afaik= as far as i know

Figured only as much... could just put it in full, for the first time at least.

So vesper can, ultimately what I was asking.

shc = supreme high command ... relic name from days long gone.

Relic??? how dare you

To clarify - Vesper speaks on behalf of the SHC, he has a significant contribution to all decisions we make. However please appreciate he can not make radical promises or decisions without consulting the rest of us.

So in short yes - Vesper is in charge on matters concerning WR but then again so is every other SHC member ( thats the council of players that make up the leadership ) Its just apart from Vesper, SA47 and Ian the rest of us arent getting involved in the actual negotiating part

GeIveI2aL wrote:Can I get something 100% confirmed;
Vesper you speak and is in charge of on going matters for TIE, regarding WR?

Vesper is a member of the Supreme High Command. To answer your question, i ll quote a piece of the The Imperium Empire's constitution:

Myself = Senatorum Imperialis. Reaper is the only other Senatorum Imperialis - and unfortunately for you guys he's pretty busy in RL at the moment and thus doesn't visit the forum's very much anymore (including T.I.E's) so is generally out of the loop.

The constitution: "The Senatorum Imperialis has power over all decisions both internally and externally of the Imperium Empire, and can only be vetoed with the express agreement of the Imperium High Court in combination with an 50% or above veto vote cast by the Supreme High Command. The Imperium High Court shares the same power as the Senatorum Imperialis,and can only be overruled/ vetoed either by a 60% or above vote cast in favour of veto by the Supreme High Command, or by the express decision/ statement of the Senatorum Imperialis. In the event of veto of both the Senatorum Imperialis and Imperium High Court a 70% vote in favour by the Supreme High Command is required, along with a 50% vote by the memberbase of The Imperium Empire - with a 50% or above turn out"

That means... Vesper and every other SHC member is free to negotiate with World Republic - but he ll need eithier my/ Reaper's consent for a proposal to become reality. That means i can and will veto any unacceptable proposals.... in which case the only way for that proposal to go through is by a 60% vote of the SHC which would overrule my decision.

Unfortunately for you guys - i think Vesper's views are similar to mine... and most/ all of the SHC also share similar views

Incidentally... yes you guessed it - The Dark Crusade only began due to the support and agreement of the SHC... which in turn have the full agreement and massive support from The Imperium Empire's members. Everything T.I.E is doing has massive backing from T.I.E's members - and unlike World Republic, T.I.E makes it a active objective to ensure all our members remain informed/ uptodate with current events regarding T.I.E's foreign policy.

Kenzu and therefore WR have pissed off ALL of T.I.E. The decision to go to war wasn't an easy one... and it was a decision taken only after the full extent of T.I.E's anger with WR became apparent.

Ian again, charming.

Right all that is understandable to the point of... How do you know Kenzu hasn't informed or doesn't inform (wether all or bits or non) all of WR the current or past circumstances?

Just to point out, people ARE individuals, everybody no matter wether we travel in packs or not.

Still owe me an apology Ian.

Okay, i talk to ALOT of people. I get info from everywhere and lots of opinions. WR gets PMs from kenzu giving bits of information. He states what TIE has done wrong. Odds are he never mentions what he has done.

I am willing to bet that WR is getting a bunch of PMs from kenzu lately saying TIE is bullying WR and we hate WR and we will sit on WR forever. None of these are true. We simple want Kenzu to be dealt with for his lies, deciet, and many other things. We actually have a good amount of members that like members in WR. TIE wont even attack WR after kenzu is gone.

Another point about kenzu not informing his alliance. When kenzu and Lord Pegasus attacked ian they went directly onto protection. Kismet, LP, and Kenzu were only WR members on protection. They literally left the rest of WR out to dry without even giving them a warning to go onto protection because he planned on attacking ian.
By end of the first week WR lost so much more then TIE it wasnt even funny. WE ONLY ATTACKED STRIKE GROUP then we planned to just let WR go and go on with our lives. asked for a diplomat at which point a hospitalized sick women was appointed. She was clueless as to what was going on. When she got back she had to read all the posts just to have some idea of what was going on before she could even think about making a post. Kudos to her for trying.

GeIveI2aL wrote:Ian again, charming.

Right all that is understandable to the point of... How do you know Kenzu hasn't informed or doesn't inform (wether all or bits or non) all of WR the current or past circumstances?

Just to point out, people ARE individuals, everybody no matter wether we travel in packs or not.

Still owe me an apology Ian.

I would like to address the bold part.

Plain and simply. If WR knows full well what Kenzu is doing, does not ask/make him stop, stands by and lets it happen, then sticks around to support him afterwards, Then it is not just Kenzu we have a problem with. It is ALL of WR.

We spent 3 months seeking peace under the "assumption" that 90% of WR had no idea of the sneaky, dirty, underhanded, backstabbing, conflict seeking actions of Kenzu. If they did, and still do, then I suggest you guys bear arms and at least fight with some honor and dignity. Not hide and remain silent hoping Kenzu gets blamed for it all when it was each of you who had a hand in it.

GeIveI2aL wrote:

Special Agent 47 wrote:

Then explain his actions, or accept its a load of hockey.

If Kenzu wanted peace, why did he

1.send an open mass mailing seeking spies and later admit it was done to stir internal conflict?
Rather... strange tactic but if Kenzu saw fit to see TIE as a problem. Cant really fully understand this one.Then answer if you condone this action as peaceful or condemn it as warmongering.
2.have a spy in our ranks, and not remove said spy even after the peace treaty was signed?
Shadow Pheonix, talking about this one? Didn't Kenzu state that he HAD NO CONTACT with this shadow phoenix for a week or so leading upto the peace treaty? Hasn't any contact since either.What difference does it make? He was a WR spy, Period. Kenzu LEFT him in TIE AFTER the treaty was signed. Period. Also, why was it the WR spy was the very one posting multiple topics about "Warring" with GD? Why was it he himself who actually made attacks on Rflash "Just to get his defense" when we had FULL stats on him? We had ranks 1 through 4 coverts in our alliance. Just coincident? Don't ask me to be so naive or stupid.
3.First fund us to fight GD, then immediately turn on us and form alliance with GD?
Come on, that can't be all whats to it. Something happened, wether GD came to Kenzu or whatever. I'll find out.By all means do so because I would love to know. Fact still remains, it is a FACT WR funded us against GD, it is a FACT WR and GD worked together in coordinated attacks on us in the second wave of the war.
4.Before the ink dried on the peace treaty, he was sending recruitment messages full of slander?
This was a mistake by Kenzu and he is sorry about it.WHERE? Show me. I have not seen it posted in forums for all to see anywhere. If I am wrong then SHOW ME and I will yield the point until then he has not apologized to me, and we have spoken, more then once. If he apologized then he admits it was wrong, yes or no?
5.Continued to wear :messages of the day" which contained statement meant to cause conflict?
Knew this would come to haunt Kenzu, so I told him to REMOVE anything containing or referring to TIE from his 'Message of the Day'. As I feared though, too late.A 9 yr old hit over the head with a stick would know what Kenzu's messages were meant to do. So once again you admit you feel he was wrong, yet you refuse to condemn him for the action or to openly say it was wrong of him.
6.Started the war, after all he did throw the first punch and fired the first shot?
2 sides to each story, as you could guess Kenzu claims TIE started. For now, were in it and I shall see about the info behind everything as quickly as possible.Please tell me your not that Blind? (I said stupid, but its not personal so I changed it), Ok let me define my point, then you tell me honestly what Kenzu has said. Kenzu started the war = Kenzu and his strike force launched the first attacks, struck the first blow, pressed the attack button repeatedly on the same account. That account was Ian's. Now you going to tell me that Kenzu denies this and says we hit first? Glad we saved all the attack logs with the time stamps on them LOL
7.Why he name kismet as WR diplomat knowing she was in the hospital and couldnt do it? all the while I'm here publicly begging for a diplomat Kenzu blind sides us with another attack NOT targeting military accounts but accounts of oppurtunity?
Whoooaaaa wait a moment.
Are you sure Kenzu knew Kismet was in the hospital? 100% sure on that? If so, how do you know that info?
Answered, Kenzu admitted he knew publicly
Think of this for a second; (Am not defending no actions)

TIE have pissed Kenzu off as much as Kenzu has done TIE
(How, god knows am still reading through but thats how it is)

Now one man with power, can do alot of damage if the said man got pissed off.

When angered, one doesn't always think straight.
You got that right, but when you cool off you change and apologize for your actions, not continue to do them.

Just curious, universe as primitive as the few posts I've seen? Gives me a laugh every time I read one

Truthfully, my frailties are my own. Am short-sighted and half deaf.

So please be aware.

But am not stupid.

I like to know why things happen, not just they do.
I like to know how things work, not because they do.
I dont condemn someone to oblivion without first knowing/having the proof.
I will not blindly follow someone.
I will not hate someone for no reason.
I certainly will not attack someone/something who is not a threat.

Equality and Understanding is how I like to live.

Am getting through all the information and speaking to Vesper as I post this.

*walks away*

good luck Vesper and G

okay so negotiations are going well. i know where G and Kismet both stand now and i think both of them know where i stand.

WR really wants peace . check out their leader's message of the day .

I am Keinutnai, leader of the World Republic (O)
World Republic is an alliance of Order Empire
To join Order Empire, or become an ally of World Republic, contact me.

---World Republic---

World Republic strives for peace and friendship with all alliances and players. Farming and raiding missions are allowed.

All missions other than those to steal kuwal, raid untrained and reconaissance are considered hostile missions.

World Republic protects its members, therefore don't mass any of our members.
Those who mass WR members (by making assault, sabotage, assassin or other hostile missions) and commit first agression should expect being massed back by World Republic. Don't mass our members and we will not mass you.

---World Republic and other alliances---

World Republic has military pacts with various brother alliances and will protect their members if attacked by any agressors.

World Republic keeps good relations with many alliances and concluded many deals and signed many treaties with other alliances.

If you want to improve/extend relations with World Republic, you can contact me and I will see what we can agree on.

---Important Notice---

The Only Thing Necessary for Evil to triumph Is for Good Men to do Nothing!

One by one, we would fall, but together we can protect each other!

The Evil will not stop, until it dominates the whole world. Let us protect each other and defend our freedom to grow in peace!

Join the defenders league!

---New Year Wishes---

Merry Christmas to all Aderan Wars players!

Let's make sure 2010 will be celebrated with a big bang!

Frohes Neues Jahr 2010! Bonne Année 2010! Happy New Year 2010!
_____________________________________________________________________

Why cant people who want to join Order contact Rflash , Babyslate08 , Redblulu , or Trotsky . Why just you .
Why doesn't your message of the day say contact any (O) Alliance leader .
How come up until yesterday the first part of your message of the day was not bold and now it is ?

Why are you calling TIE evil , you should know TIE could call you evil but they dont .
Why are u trying to use Kismet and G as a stall tactic while u gather allies to fight TIE ?

We all know what happened during peace talks last time . u with out hestiation accepted a ceasefire knowing that it didnt cover GD . So what are u gonna do it again ?

Good and Evil those terms mean nothing to me . The only thing that matters is Ambition .

Ishurue has valid points.

I'll go ask Kenzu to post in reply to that.

Also I may harbor some blame as I did ask Kenzu to edit his 'MOTD'

Sorry there but trully I dont control what he puts there.

Kenzu's MOTD doesn't mention TIE at all, so I guess they are as welcome to join his defenders league as others

Jiro wrote:Kenzu's MOTD doesn't mention TIE at all, so I guess they are as welcome to join his defenders league as others

Only because I asked Kenzu to remove anything regarding TIE.

Jiro wrote:Kenzu's MOTD doesn't mention TIE at all,

It did.

Jiro wrote: so I guess they are as welcome to join his defenders league as others

Ooh! That would be awesome. What would we be defending against? The evil supersecret alliance we all know and love?