Be All Thy Sins Remembered

I really fail to see why you think you should bring LOL in to this. The alliance is merely a bunch of people from another game that has came here to make friends and find a game they can enjoy. I came to TIE from LOL for the mere fact I was looking for active people that was playing the game and became friends with SA, Sea, and IOZ But I will stand up for LOL anyday or time so before you go pulling them into something Make sure Bugs and the High commander is here to state their part. NUFF SAID!

Father more I don't see SA here to defend his self so why not keep his name out of all this crap until which time he is here to defeat his own self and what his input is on the mess.

SA is one of the main reason I stayed playing the second time when me and Martin came back to the game, He came forth and helped us and taught us stuff we wouldn't have known and took it up on his self when he didnt have too to make sure we understood the game as best as we could.

BUT My god I think from reading back in this thread there needs to be a phyic abroad for a certain person and I certainly aren't talking about SA or any other male figure around here NOR my self

@Nigatsu - Seriously please leave this convo before i do something rash. The tensions across our alliance are pretty high and the last thing we need is someone like you yapping on about stuff that you dont really know about.

@buchore - i talked and joked with Universe since TIE formed. I enjoyed spamming along side her for a while. You probably dont understand how betrayed i feel. Me Vesper and Ian nearly fell out over this. Again if your going to make comments like "this isnt fun anymore" please leave this topic. It was never fun to begin with when you start screwing with people that are more than just people you know on a game but RL friends.

@Universe and anyone else who is reading -

The Commonwealth/The Imperium or whatever the hell you want to call it is based on one simple thing - Loyalty. I dont give a rats arse what happens to anyone that doesnt bare the tag TIE next to their name. So if there is need for war i will start a war, if i have to mass people i talk to/know/like i will do it, if i need to lie, manipulate, slander or go under cover to benefit TIE i will do it. What Universe or whoever the hell you are did was completely unacceptable as it screwed with people on a personal level by inciting distrust and suspicion - THAT i would personally never do. And all the thing i would do - if i was to be cought i would at least face the consequences and fight till the bitter end for the values i hold dear. You lack any sense of guilt, loyalty or shame. For that you are pathetic

So i dont understand why we are having this conversation. So i say it again - THE EVIDENCE AGAINST UNIVERSE HAS BEEN BROUGHT FORWARD, IF YOU DONT HAVE ANYTHING PAST "I'VE BEEN HACKED" TO SAY IM AFRAID YOU ARE FOUND TO BE GUILTY.

Everyone else can back off unless they have something to contribute that may either implicate Universe further or disprove our findings. All other crap which is being spewed is frankly rubbing me up the wrong way and im already pretty angry and frustrated. I dont need to lessons from anyone on how to play the game or what is right and wrong. I'm not saying what Universe did was "wrong" as who am i to judge right or wrong in a GAME. HOWEVER it was unacceptable to us and so we shall deal with it in ANY way we wish. END OF DISCUSSION!

Hai-Shulud wrote:
@buchore - i talked and joked with Universe since TIE formed. I enjoyed spamming along side her for a while. You probably dont understand how betrayed i feel. Me Vesper and Ian nearly fell out over this. Again if your going to make comments like "this isnt fun anymore" please leave this topic. It was never fun to begin with when you start screwing with people that are more than just people you know on a game but RL friends.

If you're so sensitive choose your friends more carefully,
I was pointing on sandwalker's post btw

Sandwalker wrote:
By "so much damage" you realize you're talking about ioz getting massed, right? I mean actual measurable damage, not emotional and what not. That's the only real damage that came of all this. I see everything else as a really fun time, a little stressful at some points, but definitely overall FUN.

Im out of here.

edited as the forum's gone crazy

@buhcore:
None of my RL friends were screwed with so yeah, I afforded myself the luxury of enjoying this whole thing. Though, it's more the victory I enjoy than the process.

And Hai has chosen well enough. We both share the same concept of loyalty.


PS: Take heed of wedges you try to drive between TIE members. They might bite you in the ass.

buhcoreTheGreat wrote:

I was more dissapointed on your reactions than her actions, i think posts like this are unexceptable

Hai-Shulud wrote:

Universe wrote:**Filtered** you, and **Filtered** you, Hai. Sweet talking me with nice words? Ridiculous. You're just another puppet on a string.

Hahahahaha sweet talk you? I woudnt piss on you if you were on fire. I wanted a confession out of you, a show of regret or at least something to say you werent just a traitor and a manipulator.

Perhaps you are Major Sue perhaps not, that we can not know for sure without further investigation. But often the simplest explanation is the right explanation.

Burn in hell

This is NOT fun anymore, it is way too personal imo,
Universe guilty or not, im sure that she was not the only one involved in this

Grrrrrrrr - ^^ you quoted me but byeeee

Universe wrote:Thank you, Ian. Exceptional reply, as I don't doubt everyone expected?

ian wrote:For the record... i just laughted out loud. Universe's latest post on this forum seems to be drawing direct inspiration from the PM i sent her ingame upon discovering her true identity.
----------------------------------------------------------
Here it is folks:

Spoiler:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That PM, in turn, draws direct inspiration from my post on the -now deleted?- Secondary TIE SHC Forums, regarding the successes and failures of ~B and the Cabal. Sorry Ian, but saying I cite you, where you are the one citing me? That's bollocks. You should know better, dear. You should have known better than to (oh, I would love to be able to say: "try to"..) break me and SA up.
Nah. If you recognise in me some nemesis from your past, that is your imagination playing tricks on you. But we'll just have to take your word for it, right? As usual?

ian wrote:Anyone who knows me well can clarify a couple of things:

1.) I have just about a functional ability to use excel. Every spreadsheet i create inevitably works, but is hopelessly inefficient, poorly planned and needs tidying up by someone better in order to make it usable for anyone else. The maths is there... it just needs a face-lift. This is as far as my coding abilities go - i can barely work excel, let alone have any idea where to start for hacking.

Whether it was you, personally, or someone within your network at your behest, is irrelevant to the issue.

ian wrote:

Spoiler:

Agreed. You show a true singlemindedness in those regards, admirable.

Spoiler:

Chess pieces. Intelligence. *grin* Marvellous history there, none of which says me anything, but I'm sure you're deeply loyal, brilliant, deceitful and adaptive. And yet you claim to have fallen into this ~B's trap so easily. That is not only surprising.. that is ridiculous. And you claim I am this ~B?! I am not the smartest person on these boards, I am not the most skilled writer. Did my stupidity make it so easy to fall into what you now call 'my trap'? Is that what you're saying? That would be somewhat insulting, and hilarious as well. It's far more likely, based on your proven intellect and history, that you are running this show.

ian wrote:

Spoiler:

Your point, please? All you have done in the past paragraphs is expose how exceptionally gifted you are, and how great a leader.
I do not deny that. At all. Have you read that somewhere? Because I am the last person to consider you stupid. Perhaps where it concerns a complete lack of respect for the friendship people have within this game, within your alliance.. but you are a great diplomat, as would any diplomat be with an arsenal such as yours, and a true master of words. Never denied that, never will.

ian wrote:

Spoiler:

We'll just have to take your word for it, won't we? It's easy to negotiate when you have what, a little over the rest of the server in total power, and an exceptionally well arranged war machine? Did I say you are Cabal, or ~B? I said, whatever suspicion you have loaded on me, is just as easily reversed.

ian wrote:

Spoiler:

Yes, because you weren't ready to attack FIRE.
What was it? "The cost of massing them before the updates come in will be massive".. "I am keeping tabs on admin's activity".. ?
Again.. we will just have to take your word for it, won't we?

ian wrote:

Spoiler:

Oh yes. We could definitely do whatever the hell we please. We did. Have you conveniently forgotten how we planned the war against FIRE for weeks after they appeared in our logs a few times too often? How we contacted LoL to see if they would work with us against FIRE? How we had a few good plans made? Or were those a trap to catch ~B you didn't tell me about when you told me about 'everything'?
Those are the actions of a peaceful alliance. Oh yes. Nah.. they're not.

ian wrote:The Imperium is all of the above - but we are governed by 2 principles: Justice & Fairness. Those who plot to destroy or hurt us, those who plot to in someway not cooexist with us... then we will do anything and everything to stop you. Those who are happy cooexisting and trying to cooperate with us - then you have absolutely nothing to fear.

We don't start fights - we merely finish them.

*choke* LOL. That may be true, but you completely disregard that there was never any indication this "Cabal" opposed TIE. Sure, the Cabal busted Dune right away, spread the news of our alliance plans with LoL, and (quoting you here, if you don't mind) "Everything FIRE has recieved from the Cabal & ~B is true." (I can quote the preceding elements as well, if you persist in your deflections?)

Did you really think I wouldn't keep my own copy of our discussions? Do you really think I'm that stupid?
It just isn't enough for you to rip the trust in me out of SA, my closest friend on this game, you have to piss on my intelligence as well?!

Back to you, Ian.
Oh, I am getting tired. *yawn* Sorry, no disrespect intended..
I think I'll go take a nap. Not like I have an obligation to reply.





And @ Shinobiwhateveryournameis; it is regrettable what has happened to your lot. You *were* farming The Imperium too much, eh? Should've thought twice. *grin* If assassinating what is left of my trained army gives you some degree of satisfaction, feel free to enjoy it. Just keep in mind that the next time you're screwed over by your own leadership's inability to distinguish the puppet master at work, my units will not be there to give you satisfaction. I guess it'll be pretty damn sour when your back is broken, again and again, until nothing of your lot remains to pose a threat to The Imperium's complete hegemony.
Told you I've quit already.. you 'silly duck', try doing something that would ACTUALLY hurt me, instead of just boosting your War Records.

@Buhcore; *grin* You didn't think I'd come out of PPT fully armed and ready to fight, did you? As I've said.. I quit. Thank you, btw.

Lol.

If I m ~B, here's a question for everyone to consider:

- When Dune, Starryager and 1/3 of FIRE joined The Imperium's ranks... why the hell would i then proceed to send Lord Ishurue that email which in turn resulted in him then attacking The Imperium without warning?

- Why ONCE i d prevoked war between TIE and FIRE by that PM, would i then proceed as TIE's leader to negotiate a ceasefire?

I m sorry Universe, but your logic is severely flawed. IF i was ~B as you claim surely the 1/3 of FIRE splitting away would have weakened them enough and I wouldn't have then weakened MY alliance by prevoking FIRE into attacking it and causing 180billion+ kuwal's worth of damage?

OR

If i was ~B i d have split the 1/3 of FIRE away THEN prevoked them into attacking The Imperium THEN as leader of The Imperium have proceeded to kick the crap out of them untill they no longer existed.

What the hell would i have to gain from splitting FIRE, then proceeding to prevoke them into attacking T.I.E and then 6hours later arranging for a ceasefire BEFORE The Imperium counter-attacks? FIRE's attack killed about 180billion kuwal's worth of resources and they lost 40 - 60billion worth. In my book thats a net loss of 140 - 120billion kuwal's worth of resources of TIE compared to FIRE i.e. FIRE comes out of the situation 140 - 120billion closer to TIE than before we entered the situation. By arranging for a ceasefire before the counter-attack, The Imperium didn't have a chance for its own kill-margins to even that score out.

Your logic is flawed. Secondly - why the hell would a SHC member be copying all our topics... unless of course she happened to have another use for them i.e. to send to FIRE?

Sandwalker wrote:@buhcore:
None of my RL friends were screwed with so yeah, I afforded myself the luxury of enjoying this whole thing. Though, it's more the victory I enjoy than the process.

And Hai has chosen well enough. We both share the same concept of loyalty.


PS: Take heed of wedges you try to drive between TIE members. They might bite you in the ass.

lol i just had to reply on that,
ur almost saying that im next "cabal" or w/e you call it?
dont try to make anything up, i never had anything against TIE and you know it, its maybe just you who doesnt like me but i dont really care about that,
i remember that seaborgium tried to spy on me and my alliance and he didnt gain anything useful that could make me feel guilty,
it's just you dune, you better start writing stories for next cabal, good luck with it - i just hope it wont be me

buhcoreTheGreat wrote:
lol i just had to reply on that,
ur almost saying that im next "cabal" or w/e you call it?
dont try to make anything up, i never had anything against TIE and you know it, its maybe just you who doesnt like me but i dont really care about that,
i remember that seaborgium tried to spy on me and he didnt gain anything useful that could make me feel guilty,
it's just you dune, you better start writing stories for next cabal, good luck with it - i just hope it wont be me

I have noticed that you always seem to have something to say against TIE and its members. I would insult Uni to compare the two of you.

Frankly, I was trying to politely say "stfu or else". But you spin that however you want, buddy.

And @ Shinobiwhateveryournameis; it is regrettable what has happened to your lot. You *were* farming The Imperium too much, eh? Should've thought twice. *grin* If assassinating what is left of my trained army gives you some degree of satisfaction, feel free to enjoy it. Just keep in mind that the next time you're screwed over by your own leadership's inability to distinguish the puppet master at work, my units will not be there to give you satisfaction. I guess it'll be pretty damn sour when your back is broken, again and again, until nothing of your lot remains to pose a threat to The Imperium's complete hegemony.
Told you I've quit already.. you 'silly duck', try doing something that would ACTUALLY hurt me, instead of just boosting your War Records. .

LOL I really have no intentions on doing anything to you more than that as it does bring me satisfaction (enough anyways) There is no point in me dwelling on whats already been done. The war records are a nice perk by the way . As for you quitting, I could care less to be honest.

@JadeFire: Good god. Can you read, girl?

I repeat, as I have done time and again, SA is my closest friend in this game (that's considering those I had in The Imperium).
I don't give a flying **Filtered** about what LoL does or doesn't do, I am giving an example of how war would have happened with or without the Cabal there to be its catalyst. What part LoL plays in that is completely besides the point. Did I say they're not good guys? I didn't think so. I haven't touched your friends, haven't insulted them, and if you believe I did that is your problem, not mine.
So please, shut up, unless you have something to contribute? Thank you very much.

On second thought, I do have a question for you, Jade. What bloody good would it do me to betray SA?! I have fought to gain his trust once, and if I have to I will do it again. But I do believe that the people responsible for this have broken that, and I will never forgive that.

Oh joy. More Ian.

ian wrote:Lol.

Spoiler:

Your logic is flawed.

Easy. @1; you needed tangible proof of hostile intent by FIRE. What better way to show hostile intent as by acts of war?
@2; It was neither feasible nor in the best interest of TIE to maintain a state of war. After instigating FIRE's attack, you had what you needed, and were able to 'negotiate' a ceasefire. A ceasefire, I'll say, you had every intention, expressed and not expressed, of using to further prepare for war.

Did you anticipate FIRE's attack to be as violent as it was? I don't know. Perhaps, just maybe, you misjudged FIRE's ability to wage war? Perhaps you were busy with other elements of your plan. How the hell am I to know that? Perhaps you DID intend for them to strike as they did, and perhaps you simply have not gotten to the retaliatory part yet. Perhaps in a way, this thread and the ridiculousness surrounding it did effect a more solid peace between the diminished FIRE, and the grown TIE.
Did your losses exceed the influx of power, units and weapons? I believe they didn't. So, as FIRE's breaking apart and 1/3 joining TIE was an actual operation of war, you should have considered those figures in your calculations.
I think Dune's armysize of what, 9, 10 million(?) covers the losses TIE suffered completely? 4 times, if I convert those values correctly. And that's not even beginning to calculate the rest of Fedaykin's economic edge being added to the biological distinctiveness of The Imperium.

So yeah. Like hell you lost anything during that little phase of hostilities. You gained 1/3 of FIRE and a permanent peace due to your playing out of the Cabal story. *grin* Nice try. Next.

ian wrote:Secondly - why the hell would a SHC member be copying all our topics... unless of course she happened to have another use for them i.e. to send to FIRE?

Quite possible, I agree.
We were, at the time, conducting an investigation into the identity of ~B, Cabal.. and we became aware of a potential hacker. What did you expect? Of course I keep my materials on hand for reference? *sigh* Cheap shot, fell short of my lines. Advance, and volley. So to speak, your 'logic' is flawed? (See what I did there? Similar cheap shot. What a waste of words.)


@Hai-Shulud: Good god. Can you read, man? What could you guys possibly do that is worse than what you lot have done to me today already? Threaten anyone who shows an inch of support, of understanding of my points of criticism, my accusations in fact towards Ian? Puppet, puppet, get back in your cage. You're out of your league.

Speaking of being somewhere, I ought not be here. I am off to bed. Fire away. The sheep mentality does not surprise me. At all. The identity of the sheep, does somewhat surprise me. Makes me doubt my ability to read people's character, if I was able to live between serpents and sheep without being the herdsman.. goodnight!

Hey Universe, you sound like whore nanny to me.

You are funny, because you said thank you very much, that is what makes you look like a fat bitch right now.

And please stop using **Flitered** it is annoying. Be man, or woman, and start learn the realy swearing word.

Like... Fuck you asshole!

-----

What i said based on it, doesn't means anything. I'm just telling you to stop using flitered. Are you kindegeratan or what?

Dissapointed with that last post - It lacked the anger the previous ones had, i would have stuck with the "im innocent" approach to "it was Ian" approach.

LOL anyone who supports you is infact also an enemy of TIE. But lets not confuse that with trying to defend you. Anyone is welcome to post evidence in either direction. Good God woman can you not read?!?! Ive already said that once!

I dont feel the need to argue against your petty attempt to brand us "sheep". I dont feel the need to argue against anything you say for that matter. I will however take the courtesy of shooting down any further pathetic attempts you may make at lying.

PS - As a side not its pathetic how stuck on the whole TIE have always wanted war, let me spell it out for everyone loud and clear - If we wanted a war we start one, we dont need to go to elaborate lengths. All it takes is a vote and i can quite happily start as many wars as we want, infact id like to think i specialise in it. Tut tut tut people, we are not morons or incompetents, we have been doing the whole Superpower thing for a loooong time. The fact that we are not arrogant or bullies should keep you satisfied but oohhhh no! If it was up to me id mass the entire server, but hey thank Vesper and Ian that we dont.

Universe wrote:@JadeFire: Good god. Can you read, girl?

I repeat, as I have done time and again, SA is my closest friend in this game (that's considering those I had in The Imperium).
I don't give a flying **Filtered** about what LoL does or doesn't do, I am giving an example of how war would have happened with or without the Cabal there to be its catalyst. What part LoL plays in that is completely besides the point. Did I say they're not good guys? I didn't think so. I haven't touched your friends, haven't insulted them, and if you believe I did that is your problem, not mine.
So please, shut up, unless you have something to contribute? Thank you very much.

On second thought, I do have a question for you, Jade. What bloody good would it do me to betray SA?! I have fought to gain his trust once, and if I have to I will do it again. But I do believe that the people responsible for this have broken that, and I will never forgive that.

First off DONT tell me to shut up! I'm a member of this forum and member of Tie so that gives me the right to speak as I feel. YOUR not Admin or Kenzu So until you are or they tell me to shut up you'll deal with it

Second all seems you already have enough problems of your own and make enough of your own.. Unlike your self I have no problems

Starryager wrote:Hey Universe, you sound like whore nanny to me.

You are funny, because you said thank you very much, that is what makes you look like a fat bitch right now.

And please stop using **Flitered** it is annoying. Be man, or woman, and start learn the realy swearing word.

Like... Fuck you asshole!

-----

What i said based on it, doesn't means anything. I'm just telling you to stop using flitered. Are you kindegeratan or what?

She is using **Filtered** instead of swearing because on alot of boards swearing is against the rules. There could be/are kids reading this and it is polite not to swear, even if it isn't against the rules. She is simply being curtious, and I think you should praise her for that not insult her. Just because people prefer to filter out the swear words does not mean they are immature, as your refernce to kindergarten suggests, but, in my opinion, shows me that she is more mature then you.

-Alex

Lol, ok Universe i m gonna have to point out a HUGE flaw in your plan.

Your trying to make yourself innocent by accussing me of being ~B. Your still trying to cause as much damage as you can between FIRE and TIE by putting just that *little* bit of doubt into their minds. You haven't stated a shred of proof to back it up... but it doesn't matter, its still doubt.

Now... here's the weak point in your plan. Lord Ishurue recieved your emails from you directly. He CAN check what the IP is by opening up the email headers fully - and he also happens to have my IP when he asked me to register on his forum. HE can check the evidence for himself. He doesn't have to rely on my word or any of T.I.E's. He can prove without a shadow of a doubt its not me behind it, and confirm your own guilt.

@ Lord Ishurue, to find what the IP is simply follow the instructions on this site - its very easy to do:

http://aruljohn.com/info/howtofindipaddress/

Or if you like here's a googlesearch - the above link is the first option on the search

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=how+to+trace+a+IP+address+gmail&meta=&aq=f&oq=

I d appreciate it if you could maybe copy what you find here? (editing out your own IP lol).

Edit: It turns out we got the IP of Lord Ishurue in the first place - so he knows for a fact it was your IP and not mine Universe.

Will reply tomorrow, just cant do it right now.

Lord Ishurue, please if you can do as Ian asks.

Uni, see PM.

Nigatsu_Aka wrote:

Spoiler:

BTW: you are Caedmon, right?... do you still play SGW? I remember that Caedmon was in a DDE alliance DoC or DoO i think... if it's you, then i'm not surprised at all how you massed Sinath.

yes i am caedmon in this game. I just changed my name to vesper today. I didnt ever play SGW though. I started off in dune. Played 2 weeks then ended up in a war with Sinath. Fair to say that when you force a war on a new player that is new to a game like dune that the new player will hold a grudge and eventually attack back. I played dune for the duration of the war. Slowly grew out of it. Then one day I went back to see what was going on 2 or 3 months after the war was over. Then I spent maybe a month or two selling UU for turns, raiding with those turns, and selling again. Continued that cycle to build turns. After i reached over 30k turns i started to raid and sell the UU to anyone that would buy it. I was selling millions and millions of UU raiding 3mil to 10mil a day. Took rank 1 DV for a short while. I then joined BW to help take out sinath. After he went to vacation i sold my account and quit

Wow, amazing story. Love hearing the stories.

The people of Disco_Vaderia, walking by on break from a BeeGees revival concert, take a look around, gasp, utter "what the crap?", and keep walking.

[However much this may appear as spam, this is in fact an honest commentary on the thread.]

Ok guys.

Some of you seem to be utterly confused as to a couple of things - and to completely crush what Universe has been saying about The Imperium's suppossed master-plan/ manipulation:

1.) Did T.I.E have a spy in FIRE's ranks?

Answer: We had someone who informed us of when anything important concerning TIE was discussed within FIRE. Nothing else was told to us about the affairs of FIRE. So not so much a spy - more a sympathiser who kept us updated on important stuff for T.I.E I.e. we learnt about FIRE's discussions on whether to join O empire to counter The Imperium.

2.) Did FIRE know?

Answer: I think i told Jiro we did about 2 - 3 days ago. Lord Ishurue and the other FIRE HC have also known about it for at least 2 days when we explained to them why T.I.E was preparing for war.

3.) Was The Imperium preparing for war against F.I.R.E?

Answer: Yes. We began preparing when we learnt of F.I.R.E's disatisfaction over our farming policy, and that they were considering contacting O Empire to counter-T.I.E. We were pretty angered/ upset that they didn't try diplomacy first.

4.) So... was T.I.E definately planning to attack FIRE?

Answer: The decision was made to prepare for war. Not to go to war. No final orders were issued and various msn conversations were held between myself and those online at the time I m online (which varies) which never reached a final verdict. The last msn conversation before the (very brief) FIRE vs. TIE war actually decided NOT to go to war and instead to persue a different approach:

09/02/2010 02:24:56 ian Vesper, seaborgium I m thinking of cancelling the war against FIRE btw
09/02/2010 02:25:05 seaborgium Vesper, ian you ass monkey
09/02/2010 02:25:17 Vesper ian, seaborgium
09/02/2010 02:25:21 ian Vesper, seaborgium I have a good reason: We need to do a strategic overview of the entire Imperium
09/02/2010 02:25:23 seaborgium Vesper, ian that means i am losing 8% of my 250k UU and 8% of my kuwal
09/02/2010 02:25:26 ian Vesper, seaborgium figure out how extensive and bad the farming is
09/02/2010 02:25:31 ian Vesper, seaborgium and who the main culprits are
09/02/2010 02:25:39 seaborgium Vesper, ian I can tell you right now
09/02/2010 02:25:40 ian Vesper, seaborgium lol, we need the strike groups ready regardless
09/02/2010 02:25:42 seaborgium Vesper, ian I don't get hit
09/02/2010 02:25:53 ian Vesper, seaborgium so the mobilisation will continue - as once the update comes out
09/02/2010 02:26:00 seaborgium Vesper, ian i had 2.5B out the other day
09/02/2010 02:26:01 ian Vesper, seaborgium its about whats invested before the war which matters
09/02/2010 02:26:05 seaborgium Vesper, ian and I know strikes can break me
09/02/2010 02:26:12 seaborgium Vesper, ian Ian part of the issue is the def rule
09/02/2010 02:26:14 Vesper ian, seaborgium your defense > vaga's strike
09/02/2010 02:26:27 seaborgium Vesper, ian but
09/02/2010 02:26:35 seaborgium Vesper, ian if you lifted the rule
09/02/2010 02:26:40 seaborgium Vesper, ian they would raise there strikes
09/02/2010 02:26:49 ian Vesper, seaborgium yeah
09/02/2010 02:26:55 ian Vesper, seaborgium i m actually thinking of a 3 tiered approach
09/02/2010 02:26:59 seaborgium Vesper, ian do you have a alliance attack log?
09/02/2010 02:27:06 ian Vesper, seaborgium 1.) We look at our accounts, work out what has to be done - defence wise then economically
09/02/2010 02:27:26 Vesper ian, seaborgium 5mil army = 3bil defense
09/02/2010 02:27:31 ian Vesper, seaborgium 2.) We get a FULL overview of the state of the imperium in terms of who's farming us - and then approach FIRE properly
09/02/2010 02:27:42 ian Vesper, seaborgium and make our case - and explain to them exactly what we expect
09/02/2010 02:27:49 ian Vesper, seaborgium 3.) We use our newly built strike teams when necessary
09/02/2010 02:27:51 seaborgium Vesper, ian for my other game, I created a place to upload the attack logs, then I could look back over a day to see who hit who
09/02/2010 02:28:12 ian Vesper, seaborgium proper defences + a properly enforced farming policy should actually limit/ stop our need to fight major wars
09/02/2010 02:28:25 Vesper ian, seaborgium we dont have full attack logs
09/02/2010 02:28:25 seaborgium Vesper, ian Good luck Ian
09/02/2010 02:28:33 Vesper ian, seaborgium cant only see each individual attack logs
09/02/2010 02:28:38 ian Vesper, seaborgium lol, yeah
09/02/2010 02:28:46 seaborgium Vesper, ian and admin won't put it in
09/02/2010 02:28:49 ian Vesper, seaborgium still.. if me, you and hai checked the logs i m sure it wouldn't take us long vesper
09/02/2010 02:29:02 ian Vesper, seaborgium literally copy & paste
09/02/2010 02:29:02 ian Vesper, seaborgium lol

Thats just one of several different conversations which covered both the for's and against's of going to war, and generally remained undecided. No final orders were ever issued for a attack time and generally as far as TIE was concerned any future war would be held at the earliest in weeks/ months - not days like is implied by ~B.

5.) Does FIRE know this?

Answer: Yes - we told FIRE about it 2 or 3 days ago. Before that we also continued throughout the last 2 weeks maintaining civil diplomacy and infact pointed out to FIRE if they have a issue with the policy to discuss it with us first

6.) Is it true a war-poll was created on whether to go to war?

Answer: A poll was created. The majority said they would support an individual of The Imperium if he decided to go to war for his own reasons, and that he shouldn't leave The Imperium to avoid us getting drawn in. No decision was reached by the leadership ever - the poll was a consultation excercise.

7.) Does FIRE know about this poll?

Answer: Yes they do - I invited them onto our forums to check the facts for themselves and gave them temporary access to The Imperium war-chamber.

8.) Does FIRE know The Imperium was behind their recent forum issues/ security problems?

Answer: Yes they do - they were told 2 - 3 days ago.

Conclusion?

Universe seems to be trying to convince you all i m ~B and that this is a massive scheme by The Imperium full of lies and manipulation of FIRE.

What Universe - and any of the other SHC members who have not been following events closely or who ve not actually asked - doesn't know is that pretty much right from the moment of the security breach becoming apparent to us on Febuary the 5th The Imperium/ Myself contacted Lord Ishurue and later FIRE and have been doing our best to cooperate with them to find ~B - including gradually making known our own "skeletons" in the closet.

Without FIRE's help ~B and the cabal would still be at large and unidentified - and that means right now both sides would be at war with the other probably.

Instead.. due to the level of cooperation and need to be completely open/ trust one another FIRE and T.I.E's relations are probably among the closest they ve been in a long while.., and hopefully will remain that way

It is because ~B was not informed, nor understood the level of cooperation which has happened the last week between all the various parties - which is why in the end we managed to catch and find out who ~B is - Universe.

Suffice it to say then: I m not ~B, and The Imperium is certainly not Cabal.

~B/ Universe only presented evidence to FIRE which showed The Imperium was preparing for war. Never was evidence given to present the actual real events - that we were preparing for war under the belief we were going to be attacked by most of the server -or that we were still very much undecided on whether war was the right course - and certainly there was no evidence/ mention provided that there was no date/ time schedule for the war.

Instead the evidence provided merely painted a view we were going to war - painting a picture of The Imperium being aggressive and warmongering. It is this - the lack of presenting a a balanced reflection of the events - which annoys me the most... this and the fact Vesper & Seaborgium were deliberately framed (i.e. evidence/ timing planted/ planned deliberately to make them suspects).

This was the IP of the Email i got from ~B .
Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of spymaster@gmx.com designates 213.165.64.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=spymaster@gmx.com
Received: (qmail 30268 invoked by uid 0); 9 Feb 2010 10:09:43 -0000
Received: from 82.92.?0.??? by www-eu002.v300.gmx.net with HTTP

howdy y'all

i've noticed that my commander is involved in this discussion, so that concerns me because... you know... he pays the bills... and until now, i liked the steady income... so could anyone make this long thread a summary please...

read the first post.

@Ishurue: As I have repeated about 10 times now, that IS my IP, and I would prefer it if you didn't put it on public display in it's entirety.

Ok guys.

Some of you seem to be utterly confused as to a couple of things - and to completely crush what Universe has been saying about The Imperium's suppossed master-plan/ manipulation:

Now this is going to be good. Thank you for telling "the truth" to everyone, ian. I am impressed. Hail ian, who has graced us with his undeniable version of "the truth". *grin* Really? More **Filtered** from you? Delightful. (Sorry I cannot match your level of infantility, Starry. A shame, it must be lovely to look at things like that.)

1.) Did T.I.E have a spy in FIRE's ranks?

Answer: We had someone who informed us of when anything important concerning TIE was discussed within FIRE. Nothing else was told to us about the affairs of FIRE. So not so much a spy - more a sympathiser who kept us updated on important stuff for T.I.E I.e. we learnt about FIRE's discussions on whether to join O empire to counter The Imperium.

Of course we had a sympathiser. Anyone who would say Dune was anything less than a full-on spy, is either naive or didn't think. Let's see if I can put this in words clearly. No wait. You did that already.. *grin*
Here:

ian, 2nd TIE SHC Forum wrote:
To clarify what the truth is:

Spoiler:

Are you trying to tell me you lied to your own High Command? Kind of like how you accused Seaborgium? With all that 'evidence' against him? *grin* So utterly hilarious. And then when this bounces, you frame me for your rather successful plan? So far, the only thing that's gone wrong is that I didn't roll over and die. Underestimated?

2.) Did FIRE know?

Answer: I think i told Jiro we did about 2 - 3 days ago. Lord Ishurue and the other FIRE HC have also known about it for at least 2 days when we explained to them why T.I.E was preparing for war.

In other words, you maintain your spy until it becomes feasible to extract him, and then, when Fedaykin/UUN/Dune's puppets moved in with TIE, you tell FIRE you have a 'sympathiser'? Entertaining. By the time you told them you had a sympathiser, your actual spy had left FIRE. And of course, brought sufficient information to make it appear as though you still did..

ian, 2nd TIE SHC Forum wrote:
To clarify what the truth is:

Spoiler:

3.) Was The Imperium preparing for war against F.I.R.E?

Answer: Yes. We began preparing when we learnt of F.I.R.E's disatisfaction over our farming policy, and that they were considering contacting O Empire to counter-T.I.E. We were pretty angered/ upset that they didn't try diplomacy first.

Oh yes.. because the whole of FIRE was such a major threat to The Imperium.. We could have sliced, buttered, and had them for breakfast before the day was up. But that wouldn't have worked to your advantage, would it? Then, you would no longer be able to tell everyone how bloody reasonable you are, would you?
Besides, it'd have been too bloody costly without the updates having come in yet. *grin* So we postponed.

ian, 2nd TIE SHC Forum wrote:
To clarify what the truth is:

Spoiler:

4.) So... was T.I.E definately planning to attack FIRE?

Answer: The decision was made to prepare for war. Not to go to war. No final orders were issued and various msn conversations were held between myself and those online at the time I m online (which varies) which never reached a final verdict. The last msn conversation before the (very brief) FIRE vs. TIE war actually decided NOT to go to war and instead to persue a different approach:

Spoiler:

Thats just one of several different conversations which covered both the for's and against's of going to war, and generally remained undecided. No final orders were ever issued for a attack time and generally as far as TIE was concerned any future war would be held at the earliest in weeks/ months - not days like is implied by ~B.

Hm, did ~B imply days? That's news to me. What a fool, he knew the updates were the main reason we would wait. The only reason anyone would divulge misinformation like that is to get their audience to .. well .. react? Like FIRE did. And we have seen how beneficial this war has been, to you.
But for everyone who has thus far failed to grasp the concepts:
It basically allows TIE to annex/usurp Fedaykin, and not have a "huge war" on your hands. Instead, you have peace. So excuse me for not buying that **Filtered**. You had too much to gain from this.

ian, 2nd TIE SHC Forum wrote:
To clarify what the truth is:

Spoiler:

5.) Does FIRE know this?

Answer: Yes - we told FIRE about it 2 or 3 days ago. Before that we also continued throughout the last 2 weeks maintaining civil diplomacy and infact pointed out to FIRE if they have a issue with the policy to discuss it with us first Smile

Well, well, well.. aren't you the shining beacon of diplomatic conduct? So we stalled, and stalled, and stalled.. after all, war, we decided, was too costly to allocate our assets to. Didn't you make another one of your lovely calculations of costs vs benefits? *grin* Such naivete.. such manipulation of the truth.

6.) Is it true a war-poll was created on whether to go to war?

Answer: A poll was created. The majority said they would support an individual of The Imperium if he decided to go to war for his own reasons, and that he shouldn't leave The Imperium to avoid us getting drawn in. No decision was reached by the leadership ever - the poll was a consultation excercise.

Yeah, I remember that thread. I remember that other thread as well. The one about how extremely expensive massing FIRE would be before the updates come in? And how they didn't realise that? Will you deny that Vesper and Hai exercised complete massing exercises, all the way to 0, on the Test Server? Will you deny that we knew with 100% certainty how expensive massing would be before the updates, and with 99% certainty -admin sometimes changes his mind- how cheap it would be after the updates in comparison? Will you deny that was the reason we collectively decided -in the SHC- to stall and keep FIRE under diplomatic lock and key?
*reads* Naah.. you wouldn't. You couldn't.

7.) Does FIRE know about this poll?

Answer: Yes they do - I invited them onto our forums to check the facts for themselves and gave them temporary access to The Imperium war-chamber.

As I said, never denied the existence of that thread. It's of no consequence, like anything posted on the non-SHC forums is. Not like we'll ever leave the actual important decisions in the hands of our grunts.. would we? We're a bloody Empire. Peons are just cannon fodder, fun to spam with, that's about the extent of how much we need them.. oh, yes. And to function as pawns in wars. Advanced weapons.

8.) Does FIRE know The Imperium was behind their recent forum issues/ security problems?

Answer: Yes they do - they were told 2 - 3 days ago.

Nice. Glad to see you admit this part without circumventing the truth. Then again, you would not have anything to gain from denying this, would you?

Conclusion?

Universe seems to be trying to convince you all i m ~B and that this is a massive scheme by The Imperium full of lies and manipulation of FIRE.

'seems'? Bloody **Filtered**, I told you straightfaced that is what I am saying.
Although where you say 'The Imperium', I would rather see you say 'Ian'. There are too many people in The Imperium who cannot possibly know any of this. That's the thing with Inner Circles, and Circles within Circles. They exclude people from the full truth.

What Universe - and any of the other SHC members who have not been following events closely or who ve not actually asked - doesn't know is that pretty much right from the moment of the security breach becoming apparent to us on Febuary the 5th The Imperium/ Myself contacted Lord Ishurue and later FIRE and have been doing our best to cooperate with them to find ~B - including gradually making known our own "skeletons" in the closet.

And these actions were.. oh, I see. You were the one leading/guiding the investigation into ~B, making the decisions about what to disclose and what not to disclose. So, operating under the assumption that you're the bloody manipulating son of a bitch we've all come to know and love as "~B", you would have every opportunity to filter what information you would and would not release.
For example. Have you informed FIRE yet, about Dune's role in The Imperium's SHC since before I joined the circle? I'm not sure you have.. because that's a skeleton that keeps dangling his arms in front of us. Poor puppet. I must admit, you do have a good sense of keeping the people who have value to you out of harm's way. Just that your list of people who have value to you is pretty damned short, isn't it? Starting with "Ian", then "The Imperium - i.e. Ian", then .. well, I'm guessing the SHC, but given the ease with which you throw me to the wolves, I do have my doubts.

Without FIRE's help ~B and the cabal would still be at large and unidentified - and that means right now both sides would be at war with the other probably.

Not if it was in the Cabal's best interest to have peace between TIE and FIRE now, would you? But I'll take your word for it. I'm sure whatever you gave Ishurue was sufficient information.

ian, 2nd TIE SHC Forum wrote:
To clarify what the truth is:

Spoiler:

Instead.. due to the level of cooperation and need to be completely open/ trust one another FIRE and T.I.E's relations are probably among the closest they ve been in a long while.., and hopefully will remain that way Smile

Yeah.. it would suck for FIRE to try and challenge the hegemonai of the game. Just as it would suck for TIE to have one of the remaining powers turn on them, disregard their farming policies, and just.. disrespect them.

It is because ~B was not informed, nor understood the level of cooperation which has happened the last week between all the various parties - which is why in the end we managed to catch and find out who ~B is - Universe.

Cooperation between you and the rest. *grin* Let's be honest here. You stopped talking to me / evaded me on MSN, probably set up another scam forum in the process, and paved the way for framing me into being your scapegoat.
I am not. And even if you convince everyone else.. I'll know I didn't do it.

Suffice it to say then: I m not ~B, and The Imperium is certainly not Cabal.

So now 'The Imperium' is supposed to be the Cabal? What makes you say that? Yes, I am calling you out as ~B, because I have no bloody clue who else would have their fingers in every pot. I have not said The Imperium is the Cabal, and I will not say that. The Imperium is way too large to be the Cabal..
Unless by "The Imperium" you refer to "The Imperium Supreme High Command"? That is a cabal, look it up in the dictionary.

~B/ Universe only presented evidence to FIRE which showed The Imperium was preparing for war. Never was evidence given to present the actual real events - that we were preparing for war under the belief we were going to be attacked by most of the server -or that we were still very much undecided on whether war was the right course - and certainly there was no evidence/ mention provided that there was no date/ time schedule for the war.

I have no idea what evidence I should have presented to FIRE, because I am not ~B. But if you say ~B left out actual details.. I'll just take your word for it. I'm good at that, until I get framed.

Instead the evidence provided merely painted a view we were going to war - painting a picture of The Imperium being aggressive and warmongering. It is this - the lack of presenting a a balanced reflection of the events - which annoys me the most... this and the fact Vesper & Seaborgium were deliberately framed (i.e. evidence/ timing planted/ planned deliberately to make them suspects).

Oh, I'm sure you're grieved. *facepalm*