Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

by Kenzu Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:15 pm

Imperium has massed Redblulu, who isn't even part of World Republic
Redblulu is alliance leader of "redblulu and company (O)".

What is the reason this alliance has been massed?

by buhcoreTheGreat Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:20 pm

Kenzu wrote:Imperium has massed Redblulu, who isn't even part of World Republic
Redblulu is alliance leader of "redblulu and company (O)".

What is the reason this alliance has been massed?

showing off? Laughing

by Sandwalker Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:46 pm

Doesn't redblublu have an MDP with WR as part of Oh! ? Was he not arming a strike? Come now...

by Kenzu Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:12 am

buhcoreTheGreat wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Imperium has massed Redblulu, who isn't even part of World Republic
Redblulu is alliance leader of "redblulu and company (O)".

What is the reason this alliance has been massed?
showing off?

When? Where?

What did he say?

by ian Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:01 am

Kenzu wrote:
buhcoreTheGreat wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Imperium has massed Redblulu, who isn't even part of World Republic
Redblulu is alliance leader of "redblulu and company (O)".

What is the reason this alliance has been massed?
showing off?

When? Where?

What did he say?

Lets see... he's an Order member. Call it a preemptive strike or whatever - but we weren't about to sit around and wait for his strike to aid you.

Kenzu wrote:If you (alliance) join Order Pact, you will be protected by all Order Pact alliances and you also agree to give full military assistance to any Order Pact alliance, who will be attacked by any alliance or individual, if that Order Pact alliance is not the agressor.

(attack in this case means full or partial massing)

If any Order Pact alliance is attacked by an agressor (alliance or individual) all Order Pact alliances will give heavy support to the attacked alliance by fighting the enemy as hard as they can.

Of course... we aren't hitting *all* of Order Empire - some we respect and have faith in that they aren't your blind sidekicks, and actually have their own individual views and ability to think for themselves - thus we are confident they ll reach the right decision and leave WR in the hole its dug for itself. Sadly - Trotsky isn't one of those as far as we are concerned.... thus he had to be neutralised.

You also forget to mention Martygg... since he (or she... not sure which?) decided to help you the last time in the war, and set all of World Republic to peace - and happened to have a rapidly growing strike since this crusade began - we figured we d pay him/her a visit Smile

It was great fun Very Happy

by Special Agent 47 Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:23 am

Glad to see Kenzu learning from his mistakes and not trying to stir more trouble LOL.

Why don't you let Redblulu stand up and speak for himself, and ask the questions that should be his to ask? They are not yours by any means.

Got your answer tho didn't you?

Kenzu, please think long and hard about what your doing, and who is really getting hurt by it.

by Jiro Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:01 am

Ian wrote:You also forget to mention Martygg... since he (or she... not sure which?) decided to help you the last time in the war, and set all of World Republic to peace - and happened to have a rapidly growing strike since this crusade began - we figured we d pay him/her a visit Smile It was great fun Very Happy

Ian, I don't know whether Matrygg was part of this conflict. Apparently he had a farming issue with Viper from when he was a small player and they had an armed discussion a month ago.
I don't know if you've talked with him, but I recommend it.

by Universe Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:53 am

Matrygg posed a threat to Imperial interests.
Redblulu posed a threat to Imperial interests.

If a few people in the World Republic arm a strike, but their known 1-man alliance associates gear up for war by building 1b+ strikes (1.8B threatens most of the Imperium), then it is a logical and sensible conclusion to reach that they are going to be part and perhaps even leading point of attack for the World Republic.

Whether or not Matrygg has, had or will have an issue with whomever is irrelevant to the decision to remove the threat altogether, except for his association with World Republic.
Same thing goes for Redblulu; posed an improportionate threat to Imperial interests without providing assurances that this account would not be used against us.

So, as far as our threat analysis goes, these people were and are members of World Republic.
I can break it down for you:
- 1 man alliance
- known current associate of World Republic
- strike over 1B

Surely you can see the reason behind this. They are/were dangerous members of World Republic and had to be removed, plain and simple.
No promises made were broken.

by Viper Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:15 am

I hit Matrygg once months ago for about 70mil kuwal. I don't remember if his defense was 0 or not but I doubt my strike was over 10mil. Personally I don't call that farming let alone a farming issue, I don't know about you or anyone else but I find it hard to believe anyone could.

As for the armed discussion, Matrygg stopped his attacks when I asked him to do so, to be honest, if he had continued his attacks, the massing he got recently would have happened a month ago. As far as I am concerned that small "incident" is done and finished with and we have moved on to bigger things, such as The Dark Crusade Smile

If he has aligned himself with WR or any other hostile alliance/empire then thats his problem and a big mistake on his part. As already mentioned, the arming of his strike made him a threat, that threat has been dealt with and will continue to be dealt with for as long as he poses a threat to The Imperium.

by Kenzu Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:07 pm

ian wrote:
Kenzu wrote:
buhcoreTheGreat wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Imperium has massed Redblulu, who isn't even part of World Republic
Redblulu is alliance leader of "redblulu and company (O)".

What is the reason this alliance has been massed?
showing off?

When? Where?

What did he say?

Lets see... he's an Order member. Call it a preemptive strike or whatever - but we weren't about to sit around and wait for his strike to aid you.

Kenzu wrote:If you (alliance) join Order Pact, you will be protected by all Order Pact alliances and you also agree to give full military assistance to any Order Pact alliance, who will be attacked by any alliance or individual, if that Order Pact alliance is not the agressor.

(attack in this case means full or partial massing)

If any Order Pact alliance is attacked by an agressor (alliance or individual) all Order Pact alliances will give heavy support to the attacked alliance by fighting the enemy as hard as they can.

Of course... we aren't hitting *all* of Order Empire - some we respect and have faith in that they aren't your blind sidekicks, and actually have their own individual views and ability to think for themselves - thus we are confident they ll reach the right decision and leave WR in the hole its dug for itself. Sadly - Trotsky isn't one of those as far as we are concerned.... thus he had to be neutralised.

You also forget to mention Martygg... since he (or she... not sure which?) decided to help you the last time in the war, and set all of World Republic to peace - and happened to have a rapidly growing strike since this crusade began - we figured we d pay him/her a visit It was great fun

Universe wrote:Matrygg posed a threat to Imperial interests.
Redblulu posed a threat to Imperial interests.

If a few people in the World Republic arm a strike, but their known 1-man alliance associates gear up for war by building 1b+ strikes (1.8B threatens most of the Imperium), then it is a logical and sensible conclusion to reach that they are going to be part and perhaps even leading point of attack for the World Republic.

Whether or not Matrygg has, had or will have an issue with whomever is irrelevant to the decision to remove the threat altogether, except for his association with World Republic.
Same thing goes for Redblulu; posed an improportionate threat to Imperial interests without providing assurances that this account would not be used against us.

So, as far as our threat analysis goes, these people were and are members of World Republic.
I can break it down for you:
- 1 man alliance
- known current associate of World Republic
- strike over 1B

Surely you can see the reason behind this. They are/were dangerous members of World Republic and had to be removed, plain and simple.
No promises made were broken.

Viper wrote:I hit Matrygg once months ago for about 70mil kuwal. I don't remember if his defense was 0 or not but I doubt my strike was over 10mil. Personally I don't call that farming let alone a farming issue, I don't know about you or anyone else but I find it hard to believe anyone could.

As for the armed discussion, Matrygg stopped his attacks when I asked him to do so, to be honest, if he had continued his attacks, the massing he got recently would have happened a month ago. As far as I am concerned that small "incident" is done and finished with and we have moved on to bigger things, such as The Dark Crusade

If he has aligned himself with WR or any other hostile alliance/empire then thats his problem and a big mistake on his part. As already mentioned, the arming of his strike made him a threat, that threat has been dealt with and will continue to be dealt with for as long as he poses a threat to The Imperium.

Does this mean that you will consider anyone a threat who will have 1 billion strike?

It seems to me that you will accuse anyone who has a big strike to be our ally and based on this claim you will mass them.
Is that what you want to say?

Besides, Matrygg wasn't our ally, you have massed an innocent player (again).

by Universe Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:38 pm

Kenzu wrote:Does this mean that you will consider anyone a threat who will have 1 billion strike?

Anyone who can beat most of our defences is a threat, just not all threats need to be dealt with through massing. Most people can simply be.. pressed.. to join our good cause, or at least abstain from joining the ranks of the Red Threat.

Kenzu wrote:It seems to me that you will accuse anyone who has a big strike to be our ally and based on this claim you will mass them.
Is that what you want to say?

Given your propensity to underhanded subterfuge and deceit, I can see why you would want to twist our words like that. I can quite imagine you saying this, and using it against your enemies.
However, you are ignoring -at least- 2 things.

Universe wrote:- 1 man alliance
- known current associate of World Republic
- strike over 1B

If all are answered 'yes', then said person is likely to be a "High" threat. Of course, we can have received information convincing us to lower that person's threat level, and that does happen.. but if we do not, then it is quite simple. Prepare guns and fire. Bing bing, strike gone, threat level "Low". Resolved.

Kenzu wrote:Besides, Matrygg wasn't our ally, you have massed an innocent player (again).

Of course you would say that. Wink

I don't blame you either. If I were you I'd grasp on every last straw I could find too.. must feel bad, losing grip on the situation?

by Jiro Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:06 pm

Universe wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Does this mean that you will consider anyone a threat who will have 1 billion strike?
Anyone who can beat most of our defences is a threat, just not all threats need to be dealt with through massing. Most people can simply be.. pressed.. to join our good cause, or at least abstain from joining the ranks of the Red Threat.

And some people that are a threat can be just left alone because they do the same to you. Not everything on AW is about TIE or WR.

Universe wrote:
Kenzu wrote:It seems to me that you will accuse anyone who has a big strike to be our ally and based on this claim you will mass them.
Is that what you want to say?
Given your propensity to underhanded subterfuge and deceit, I can see why you would want to twist our words like that. I can quite imagine you saying this, and using it against your enemies.
However, you are ignoring -at least- 2 things.
Universe wrote:- 1 man alliance
- known current associate of World Republic
- strike over 1B
If all are answered 'yes', then said person is likely to be a "High" threat. Of course, we can have received information convincing us to lower that person's threat level, and that does happen.. but if we do not, then it is quite simple. Prepare guns and fire. Bing bing, strike gone, threat level "Low". Resolved.

This does resemble the diplomacy Kenzu advocated in the Tackless Shadow case. I'd say talk first, shoot later once you ascertain that a threat is not an assumed enemy, but a real one. There's no point in making an enemy out of a potential powerful ally.

Universe wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Besides, Matrygg wasn't our ally, you have massed an innocent player (again).
Of course you would say that. I don't blame you either. If I were you I'd grasp on every last straw I could find too.. must feel bad, losing grip on the situation?

I know Kenzu suffers from a credibility issue. At this point in time, it would be as valid for Kenzu to declare all people his allies and have you attack them. I'd find you more credible if you said you tried to talk to Matrygg and were convinced he was your enemy afterwards. Even now, I'd say talk to him and admit it if you were wrong. If you were right, well you massed him already for it.

by Universe Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:25 pm

Jiro wrote:And some people that are a threat can be just left alone because they do the same to you. Not everything on AW is about TIE or WR.

Thank heavens it's not! No, it's not just about TI or WR, that would become too boring too quickly. Plenty of threats are still around, we have a good working relationship with most, if not all, remaining threats. Take Lord Ishurue. Massive threat. But amiable and trustworthy in conversation, so we can maintain our policy, they maintain theirs, and we're all happy friends in this game.

Jiro wrote:This does resemble the diplomacy Kenzu advocated in the Tackless Shadow case. I'd say talk first, shoot later once you ascertain that a threat is not an assumed enemy, but a real one. There's no point in making an enemy out of a potential powerful ally.

He's not our enemy.. he's no threat anymore. And he's no longer powerful enough to become one again soon. But I understand where you're coming from.

by ian Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:21 pm

Jiro wrote:
Universe wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Does this mean that you will consider anyone a threat who will have 1 billion strike?
Anyone who can beat most of our defences is a threat, just not all threats need to be dealt with through massing. Most people can simply be.. pressed.. to join our good cause, or at least abstain from joining the ranks of the Red Threat.
And some people that are a threat can be just left alone because they do the same to you. Not everything on AW is about TIE or WR.
Universe wrote:
Kenzu wrote:It seems to me that you will accuse anyone who has a big strike to be our ally and based on this claim you will mass them.
Is that what you want to say?
Given your propensity to underhanded subterfuge and deceit, I can see why you would want to twist our words like that. I can quite imagine you saying this, and using it against your enemies.
However, you are ignoring -at least- 2 things.
Universe wrote:- 1 man alliance
- known current associate of World Republic
- strike over 1B
If all are answered 'yes', then said person is likely to be a "High" threat. Of course, we can have received information convincing us to lower that person's threat level, and that does happen.. but if we do not, then it is quite simple. Prepare guns and fire. Bing bing, strike gone, threat level "Low". Resolved.
This does resemble the diplomacy Kenzu advocated in the Tackless Shadow case. I'd say talk first, shoot later once you ascertain that a threat is not an assumed enemy, but a real one. There's no point in making an enemy out of a potential powerful ally.
Universe wrote:
Kenzu wrote:Besides, Matrygg wasn't our ally, you have massed an innocent player (again).
Of course you would say that. I don't blame you either. If I were you I'd grasp on every last straw I could find too.. must feel bad, losing grip on the situation?
I know Kenzu suffers from a credibility issue. At this point in time, it would be as valid for Kenzu to declare all people his allies and have you attack them. I'd find you more credible if you said you tried to talk to Matrygg and were convinced he was your enemy afterwards. Even now, I'd say talk to him and admit it if you were wrong. If you were right, well you massed him already for it.

Jiro - i believe your looking at this with a biased perspective to be honest. While you ve told me where you and New Federation stand - which i have a lot of respect for you over - i do feel your views are clouding your judgement and making you ignore crucial details.

For instance - you say we should have contacted Martygg and attempted diplomacy, and that we are no better than WR was over the Tackless Shadow incident. By making such a statement, your not even attempting to deal with the following points:

1.) A TIE member - Viper - was massed by Martygg without any attempt at diplomacy over a single 70million kuwal hit. He may have backed off when asked to (by Viper, not by T.I.E as a whole) - but the actions had already been done.
2.) TIE at the time was dealing with the counter-attack by World Republic and GD - thus Martygg was not dealt with.
3.) Martygg declared peace on World Republic and appears in several other TIE member's logs during the first war.
4.) Since the end of the war - Martygg has never attempted to contact TIE or to apologise for his actions against us.

Now, basically there is 2 ways of looking at things here. Eithier:

1.) Martygg is NOT a ally of World Republic and his war against TIE happened to coiincide with their war against T.I.E. If this is the case - he massed Viper and hit (causing minor damage individually... but which still adds up) several other T.I.E members without any attempt at diplomacy. He has not once attempted to contact any of the T.I.E leadership to explain his actions - and was never counter-attacked against. If he is not part of the Order Empire - then the peace treaty did not apply to him. His actions in massing Viper and hitting other T.I.E members declared war - it has merely taken T.I.E 4+ weeks to respond.

2.) Martygg IS a ally and follower of Kenzu - in which case he is a target under The Dark Crusade.

Under eithier option - Martygg got what was coming to him. He started a war - much like the rest of Kenzu's follower's - The Imperium Empire will now finish that war. Plain and simple really.

There is pretty much nothing to talk about - whats there to say? "you massed a T.I.E member... now your going to suffer the consequences" - "oh ok... damn i thought you d forgetten about me" - "nope..."

Like i ve said a 1000 times - every action The Imperium Empire takes is after careful thought and consideration... and we often do not bother explaining the full-thought process to the rest of the server... since it is after all T.I.E's business and none of their concern. Our actions are always based on being fair and just - but that doesn't mean we can't defend ourselves or avenge hostile conduct committed against us for no good reason.

by seaborgium Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:28 pm

oh i can see this being good for me Razz

starts to rack up UU to sell Razz

by ian Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:44 pm

Kenzu wrote:
Viper wrote:I hit Matrygg once months ago for about 70mil kuwal. I don't remember if his defense was 0 or not but I doubt my strike was over 10mil. Personally I don't call that farming let alone a farming issue, I don't know about you or anyone else but I find it hard to believe anyone could.

As for the armed discussion, Matrygg stopped his attacks when I asked him to do so, to be honest, if he had continued his attacks, the massing he got recently would have happened a month ago. As far as I am concerned that small "incident" is done and finished with and we have moved on to bigger things, such as The Dark Crusade

If he has aligned himself with WR or any other hostile alliance/empire then thats his problem and a big mistake on his part. As already mentioned, the arming of his strike made him a threat, that threat has been dealt with and will continue to be dealt with for as long as he poses a threat to The Imperium.

Does this mean that you will consider anyone a threat who will have 1 billion strike?

It seems to me that you will accuse anyone who has a big strike to be our ally and based on this claim you will mass them.
Is that what you want to say?

Besides, Matrygg wasn't our ally, you have massed an innocent player (again).

@ anyone reading this. Of course - once again Kenzu offers his opinion which is eithier:

1.) Not in full possession of the facts (i.e. he speaks before bothering to get the full-details)
2.) A deliberate distortion of the facts.

In this case - i suspect its both. I also like the way Kenzu has chosen to call Martygg innocent...mainly because it only serves his slander and hate campaign against T.I.E to try and provide yet another detail of our "evilness".

Unfortunately, in doing just that he's just shown himself to be the 2 faced manipulating worm that he is.

You see.... unless i m mistaken one of Kenzu's main rallying calls to arms is that The Imperium Empire, once we have complete control over the server, will mass any farmers who touch us. Apparently this is nasty and evil - something i agree with (which is why T.I.E has never done it, nor will never do).

Yet when another player masses a T.I.E player for a single 70million kuwal hit (i.e. farming!) and then proceeds after hitting that T.I.E player, to hit several other T.I.E player's who didn't even know he existed before his action - when T.I.E then counter-attacks against that player he's "innocent" and its "big nasty aggressive T.I.E" being at fault. Anyone else see the double standards here? Rolling Eyes

Principles and morality - for people like myself they are the centrepiece of our actions and decisions on games such as these. They are what The Imperium Empire's actions are based upon. We will never compromise on our principles.

For Kenzu - principles and morality is just something useful for rallying new members to his banner, for spreading his influence. They change to reflect the situation as and when necessary.

I.e. before T.I.,E intervened World Republic was happy smashing small players accounts without diplomacy - and happily gloating about it on the forum. They were happy about messaging small new players when those small new players raided inactive WR accounts - and threatening to mass those small new players if they didn't stop, since those accounts were reserved for World Republic. They were happy trying to infiltrate other alliances for the purposes of trying to cause internal unrest - or in the event they succeeded, to gain information on them. They were happy to switch sides between alliances in order to ensure no single alliance had a advantage over them - first siding with The Company against GD, to break GD's power - then trying to side with GD and The Commonwealth against The Company. In the last war they were happy to mass "target's of opportunity" i.e. players with lots to loose, in T.I.E's ranks - regardless of if those players had ever touched WR.

Yet now.... all of a sudden because The Imperium Empire has drawn a line against World Republic's unacceptable conduct - we are the evil nasty aggressive one's. It WAS The Imperium Empire which forced World Republic to adopt its code of conduct which has put an end (we hope) to WR's threatening and attacks on small players. It WAS The Imperium Empire which threatened World Republic with war unless they stop hitting small players and start using diplomacy. It IS The Imperium Empire which is now holding World Republic to account for their actions - not just against The Imperium Empire, but against small players, Geto-dacii, The Company, The Commonwealth, The Others and many other unnamed parties.

Our actions have always been based on principles - to treat others how you d want to be treated. To be peaceful and not bother others - and if bothered to try and resolve the issues peacefully. Thats why we ve spent the better part of 3months in various states of peace negotiations. Thats why we extended protection to every small player on the server who suffers at WR's hands - and thats why now, with World Republic having violated every principle we hold dear - we are enforcing our last principle: To defend them to the last.

World Republic will eithier act fairly and justly on Aderan War's again - meaning stopping all the stunts its been pulling - or it will fall at The Imperium Empire's hands. We will fight for as long as necessary - whether that be weeks, months or even years. There can be no peace with World Republic as long as they choose to be hostile to other alliances - whether by spying on them, sending out hostile recruitment messages, sending out hostile "alliance" messages, or distorting facts and truths to reflect themselves in a better light, and the other alliances in a worse - or whether by outright lieing.

One way or another - Order will prevail in the face of chaos.

by Vesper Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:19 pm

Plenty of people have over 1bil strikes that we dont even touch and have no intentions of hitting at any point. WR does not arm strikes. They BEG literally BEG other alliances to come to their aid and sacrifice their own resources when TIE poses no threat to them at all. If WR never went around begging every1 for aid TIE would be able to concentrate just on WR.

Massing Redblulululu was common sense. There are 2 public alliances in (O) other then WR. 1 is Trotsky who for some reason flees WR everytime a war kicks off and then redblulu.

Massing Matrygg was highly recommended by a outside viewpoint. If some1 that is a known associate of WR arms nearly a 2bil strike what the hell do you expect to happen. Kenzu you calling for aid is the main cause of this. Imagine this, an alliance leader fights his own battles. This little war would not even be happening if you, KENZU, stepped down as leader. I am stumped as to how in the world only 1 person voted to kick you from leadership when i personally spoke with more then 1 person that wants to see you done for in your own alliance.

by Sponsored content

Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

corrected the quote tag

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance

Re: Imperium massed redblulu from redblulu and company (O) alliance