War between World Republic and The Commonwealth

by Kenzu Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:43 pm

ian declared war on the World Republic on Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:02 pm

After trying to prevent the war between World Republic and The Commonwealth during the ultimatums, seing the masssive build up of Commonwealth and its ally, after finding out that ian and his allies will go to war no matter what, and after ian's war declaration,

World Republic has no choice but to fight a war World Republic never wanted against ian and his allies.

To make it clear for everyone, it was ian, who declared war on World Republic, on behalf of The Commonwealth.

Here is ian's official war declaration together with what has been said before:

https://aderanwars.forumotion.com/alliance-wars-treaties-f4/for-lasting-peace-t925-30.htm#7996

ian wrote:
Kenzu wrote:The only person I am questioning is ian. No one else. He is behind all the lies. He is behind all the trouble.

ian wrote:Kenzu, thats a really nice suicide note you ve just wrote there. Any last requests?

Why is that a suicide note?

Show me some evidence, because I don't think you can provide any real evidence except bollocks.

You know what kenzu - your as good as dead. There will NEVER be peace between world republic and The Commonwealth. NEVER. No surrender, no retreat, no rest. You ve just lied your last time - we will drive you from this game and make sure you can never build a account ever again. You might as well quit - because i am well and truly sick to death of your lies. Your lie here - about vance - is unforgivable.

I ve never made a promise such as this before in all my 3 years on these sort of games, and never thought i d make such a promise - but i promise here and now, that no matter the sufferring or hardship inflicted, no matter the cost - I and anyone willing to follow me will sit on you untill all eternity. We will fight you never ending - we will destroy you and all who follow you.

Your a dead man.

I would also like to add that ian has lost much more than his 5 day income.
On the 10th october he had an income of 89.000.000 per turn before AE.
His AE was around 38% (plus or minus 0.2%)
His income per day was 1.623.360.000 (mine was over 2 billion at that time)
Let's assume his income increased to 1.700.000.000 on the day of his complete annihilation. (he lost 17 billion)
(And yet again ian was lying. This time about his income. His income is far below my income and he states he earns 3 billion per day.)
I know exactly how much he earns, because we have almost the same population and I know all his stats.
It will take ian 10 days to rebuild what he lost with his income (he lost 17 billion)

Korruption will take forever to rebuild what he has lost (lost 19.5 billion).
If he didnt loose income units, it would take him 30-45 days to rebuild.

Our total expenses were a small fraction of this.

by ian Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:55 pm

Kenzu wrote:ian declared war on the World Republic on Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:02 pm

After trying to prevent the war between World Republic and The Commonwealth during the ultimatums, seing the masssive build up of Commonwealth and its ally, after finding out that ian and his allies will go to war no matter what, and after ian's war declaration,

World Republic has no choice but to fight a war World Republic never wanted against ian and his allies.

To make it clear for everyone, it was ian, who declared war on World Republic, on behalf of The Commonwealth.

Here is ian's official war declaration together with what has been said before:

https://aderanwars.forumotion.com/alliance-wars-treaties-f4/for-lasting-peace-t925-30.htm#7996
ian wrote:
Kenzu wrote:The only person I am questioning is ian. No one else. He is behind all the lies. He is behind all the trouble.

ian wrote:Kenzu, thats a really nice suicide note you ve just wrote there. Any last requests?

Why is that a suicide note?

Show me some evidence, because I don't think you can provide any real evidence except bollocks.

You know what kenzu - your as good as dead. There will NEVER be peace between world republic and The Commonwealth. NEVER. No surrender, no retreat, no rest. You ve just lied your last time - we will drive you from this game and make sure you can never build a account ever again. You might as well quit - because i am well and truly sick to death of your lies. Your lie here - about vance - is unforgivable.

I ve never made a promise such as this before in all my 3 years on these sort of games, and never thought i d make such a promise - but i promise here and now, that no matter the sufferring or hardship inflicted, no matter the cost - I and anyone willing to follow me will sit on you untill all eternity. We will fight you never ending - we will destroy you and all who follow you.

Your a dead man.

I would also like to add that ian has lost much more than his 5 day income.
On the 10th october he had an income of 89.000.000 per turn before AE.
His AE was around 38% (plus or minus 0.2%)
His income per day was 1.623.360.000 (mine was over 2 billion at that time)
Let's assume his income increased to 1.700.000.000 on the day of his complete annihilation. (he lost 17 billion)
(And yet again ian was lying. This time about his income. His income is far below my income and he states he earns 3 billion per day.)
I know exactly how much he earns, because we have almost the same population and I know all his stats.
It will take ian 10 days to rebuild what he lost with his income (he lost 17 billion)

Korruption will take forever to rebuild what he has lost (lost 19.5 billion).
If he didnt loose income units, it would take him 30-45 days to rebuild.

Our total expenses were a small fraction of this.

LOL, how the hell did i declare war exactly? That post you quoted was published on october the 12th, 9.02 pm.

Now, lets go look at the following post (which you ve conveinently ignored) - posted at 11.15pm on October the 12th.

ian wrote:
tacoman wrote:dont lisen to ian he is just tring to undermine WR

lol, why exactly would i want to undermine World Republic? Lets evaluate exactly what you just said.

Undermine, means you need to have something to undermine. That is thus an assumption that World Republic will continue to exist.

You have Kenzu, and a handful of other WR players busy telling the server i want to eliminate world republic as a major power/ oppossition to The Imperium Empire - that means eithier a.) If Kenzu/ WR are to believed, there won't be anything left of World Republic after i m finished with it or b.) World Republic's power and capacity will have been curved via military force to such an extent that they cease being a threat to The Imperium - or indeed cease being a threat to hardly anyone.

In both options... it bids the question, why waste my time trying to undermine eithier options if the end result will be a severely weakened/ non existent world republic - whats the point, and whats to be gained via such efforts?

Infact - there is a more sinister objective to all these topics i forgot to mention in my reply to admin, which i ll now add into the debate. Via my and reaper's continuing to ask Kenzu to be honest/ open with us - and via the very continuation of these topics.... it in inessence meant Kenzu had a choice of eithier replying back to the topic honestly (thus averting a war) - or via replying back lieing. Consequently each time he lies - it is simply another example of his mentality which can be used to highlight exactly why a war against World Republic needs to be conducted.

Every little or big lie stated on these topics... makes a war that little bit easier to explain to The Imperium member - since it provides very visible, very public examples of the reasons why World Republic has to be brought to heel. Consequently - the protracted and lengthy discussions, only served as ever more opportunities for Kenzu to do what he does (lies) on a public basis - providing ever greater reason and ever more examples for those who believe what The Imperium has to say (thus ever greater examples for the imperium memberbase to see, read and understand).

Of course myself and Reaper hoped that each of the times we gave Kenzu/ World Republic a chance to come clean that they d take the opportunity to do so - thus averting a war - but if they didn't, the lengthy discussions with lots of examples to quote and point to, have simply made it easier for The Imperium to accept that war is necessary.

This topic and the other related topic was never about discrediting World Republic publically - it was all about serving as a useful interactive growing list of statements, views and policies - whether based on lies or facts - all of which could then be looked at, and would consequently have a very very significant and real impact upon the future and present relations between World Republic and The Imperium.

Finally, this topic has offerred Kenzu and World Republic the chance to publically defend themselves against the (true) allegations made by The Imperium High Command members (Myself, reaper and others). The judge/ jury is The Imperium members - for at the end of the day its their opinions which will decide whether or not The Imperium will go to war against World Republic, and they aren't in anyway robots - had Kenzu and WR been able to make a successfull argument, its certain many Imperium Members would have questioned exactly why we are going to war, and would not have supported it - making a war not possible. In this event... anyone who supported it would likely have been discredited.

However... Kenzu and WR have failed to make a successfull argument which has managed to convince those soon to be their enemies, that there is no cause to be enemies. Instead - they ve merely served to chuck out insults and allegations of their own (against those who will decide their fate).... which have undoubtedly had a damaging effect on their reputation and credibility in the eyes of those who will each individually make the decision to support The Imperium in war - and which as a result will collectively influence The Imperium's conduct.

This topic, and all the related topics - haven't necessarily been about whats happening, and whats been done - its all been about providing a very accurate, very reliable large example from which to draw a very basic conclusion - should The Imperium go to war against World Republic or not? - and if so, to what extent, if any, should the conflict be limited?

Cheers Kenzu + whoever else for mounting a spirited defence of World Republic's view points.... while i still stand by that they are wrong, not to mention horribly morally wrong.... we ll have to simply agree to disagree.

So - before the final decision is made by The Imperium collective regarding your and World Republic's fate - as a final act of sportsmanship i ll be happy to ask you - is there anything more you d like to say/ appeal to The Imperium Memberbase before they make their decision? Remember at the end of the day - the opinions of the rest of the server count for minimal currently, since honestly the rest of the server can't influence the current situation to any great extent at all - so its The Imperium Memberbase your going to have to seek to convince...

My declaration of war never happened Kenzu i m afraid. I swore to drive you from the game - but never provided a time limit or date for when i d uphold that promise. I did however, 2hours later (clearly demonstrating a change of mind over my previous post) - make it pretty damn clear war hadn't yet been fully decided on, and offerred you and World Republic one final public chance to say something before the decision was put to The Imperium collective. You cannot argue with this - i made it damn clear 2 hours after i had posted the initial post you quoted (having had a very public change of heart and U turn on the promise), that i d be happy to give World Republic one last chance to appeal to The Imperium.

You guys fired first in this war. World Republic declared war on THE IMPERIUM. The Commonwealth and The Company are one. An attack on one, is an attack on both.

That post 2 hours later clearly showed war hadn't started yet in my books - since i clearly said/ implied a final decision hadn't yet been made - and that coupled with the complete lack of any official war declaration (care to point to me where i expressly declared war, or made a war topic?) pretty much sums up who started this fight.

by ian Wed Oct 14, 2009 1:02 pm

Kenzu wrote:
ian wrote:
Kenzu wrote:The only person I am questioning is ian. No one else. He is behind all the lies. He is behind all the trouble.

ian wrote:Kenzu, thats a really nice suicide note you ve just wrote there. Any last requests?

Why is that a suicide note?

Show me some evidence, because I don't think you can provide any real evidence except bollocks.

You know what kenzu - your as good as dead. There will NEVER be peace between world republic and The Commonwealth. NEVER. No surrender, no retreat, no rest. You ve just lied your last time - we will drive you from this game and make sure you can never build a account ever again. You might as well quit - because i am well and truly sick to death of your lies. Your lie here - about vance - is unforgivable.

I ve never made a promise such as this before in all my 3 years on these sort of games, and never thought i d make such a promise - but i promise here and now, that no matter the sufferring or hardship inflicted, no matter the cost - I and anyone willing to follow me will sit on you untill all eternity. We will fight you never ending - we will destroy you and all who follow you.

Your a dead man.

I would also like to add that ian has lost much more than his 5 day income.
On the 10th october he had an income of 89.000.000 per turn before AE.
His AE was around 38% (plus or minus 0.2%)
His income per day was 1.623.360.000 (mine was over 2 billion at that time)
Let's assume his income increased to 1.700.000.000 on the day of his complete annihilation. (he lost 17 billion)
(And yet again ian was lying. This time about his income. His income is far below my income and he states he earns 3 billion per day.)
I know exactly how much he earns, because we have almost the same population and I know all his stats.
It will take ian 10 days to rebuild what he lost with his income (he lost 17 billion)

Korruption will take 30-40 days to rebuild what he has lost (lost 19.5 billion)

Our total expenses were a small fraction of this.

*coughs* - please go re-read what i wrote. Infact - i ll go grab it for you now.

ian wrote:World Republic just elected to declare war on The Imperium Sucks when your enemy comes online half way through though doesn't it guys?

So - now for the butchers bill.

I started off with 10,000 attack supers, 50,000 spies, 50,000 assassins, 30,000 defence supers and 30,000 IFV's, 100,000 miners and 60,000 workers.

Currently i stand at:

Workers (60 income per turn) 58,899 (0) - 1,101 workers - 155,000,000 kuwal's worth.
Miners (70 income per turn) 95,468 (0) - 4,532 miners - 500,000,000 kuwal's worth

Spies 47,385 (0) - 2,615 spies - 380,000,000 kuwal's worth
Assassins 19,477 (0) - 30,523 assassins - 4,425,000,000 kuwal's worth (including training costs)
Trained Defense Supers 13,296 (0) - 16,704 - 4,176,000,000 kuwal's worth (including training costs)
Trained Attack Supers 8,203 (0) - 1,797 attack supers, so including training costs - 450,000,000 kuwal's worth.

I lost all 30,000 IFV's - so 5,520,000,000 kuwal's worth.

Total kuwal loss: 15,606,000,000 kuwal's worth. My daily economy currently stands at 3,087,863,904 - they wiped out 5.05 day's worth of resources

Now... you ll notice i said daily economy. Not daily income. Since I have supporter status, that means unit production is a sellable asset to raise the kuwal necessary. Therefore my daily economy = (Unit Production x 100,000 (UU value)) + Turn income x 48. The end result is my daily economy was at 3,087,863,904 - its now more than that.

That 17billion figure is 2billion off... assuming your counting my UU losses in the value of kuwal. If you disagree with it - please provide evidence. I know for a fact however, how many defence supers, spies, assassins and attack supers i had to start off with - and how many attack/ defence weapons - and i posted how many i had left after i got back online. The 2billion kuwal your off by could amount to you factoring in my attack weapons being broke... they weren't,. They were at about 284 point's damage when i got online.

As for your losses - your repair costs, pretty much summed them up below:

ian wrote:Estimated costs for World Republic's failed attack upon myself:

Lord Pegasus used a strike about 1.5 times the size of my defence give or take - with 45,000 armed supers. Estimated repair costs are about 7 - 8 billion kuwal's worth for ALL assaults conducted upon me (including the 6 which he then gave upon when he realised i was online)

Lord Pegasus also lost 8,488 attack supers in the assault on my defence - including training costs thats 2,122,000,000 kuwal's worth.

Kenzu lost a further 532 attack supers while attempting to hunt my assassins when i came online - so a further 133,000,000 kuwal cost.

Kenzu lost a further 1,175 attack supers while trying to destroy my strike - a further 293,700,000 kuwal's worth. Repair costs for Kenzu would have been about 2 - 3billion kuwal. Maybe more.

2615 enemy assassins also died killing some of my spies - so another 379,175,000 kuwal' cost

A total of 25 assaults were conducted against me - 500 attack turns (500million kuwal value)

A total of 6 invasions were conducted against me - 60 attack turns (60million kuwal)

A total of 6 destruction missions were conducted against me - 90 attack turns (90million kuwal).

Estimated cost for WR overall: 14,284,175,000 kuwal. Given you caught me suprise... thats a terrible performance all round.

kenzu, kismet and Lord Pegasus are now hiding on PPT.

The only thing you can debate above is the repair costs for the weapons. Given the size of the strike used.. those figures i posted can't be more than 1 -3billion off. Unless of course - your going to tell me you guys didn't loose all those UU, attack supers, assassins etc... which i ve got you down as loosing?

by Vesper Wed Oct 14, 2009 1:57 pm

hmm, how many days economy did thulk an october lose?

It cost me total
450 attack turns (450,000,000) kuwal value)
0 attack supers
Repair costs (400,000,000 + or - 100,000,000)

Total costs for me (750,000,000 to 950,000,000 kuwal)

Damage to the two of them
170k miners (17,000,000,000 worth of kuwal)
7k defense supers (1,050,000,000 kuwal value)

Cost to them (18,050,000,000 kuwal)

by Sandwalker Wed Oct 14, 2009 2:02 pm

I killed around 230k - 240k off the two. They are about HALF their original size. No matter. WR will fight TC forever? Let's see how long forever lasts, shall we? I took a similar vow (against The Commonwealth) like you did just now, Kenzu. It was a long time ago and I had the right to be pissed. I got what I wanted then, but I DOUBT you will get anything now.

by ian Wed Oct 14, 2009 2:06 pm

LOL, i overlooked the "we will fight the commonwealth forever"... i m not gonna comment on that statement - other than shouldn't that be "we will fight The Imperium forever"?

The Commonwealth + The Company = one. Both alliances are integrated, and both alliances had a say in this decision (or rather, lack of say in this decision, since WR started the war - but they were happy to go to war if The Imperium member's decided there was justification for war). Honestly... by all means go after just The Commonwealth, we are the one alliance fully prepared for war (as in... no excess defence, spies, assassins, income units which can be killed etc...) - it ll just prove a useful exercise to keep our warfighting talents up Smile

by Vesper Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:25 pm

I am sure that Kenzu noticed in the logs of october and thulk that there were attackers from The Company and The Commonwealth. I dont think he fully understands how long we have been working together.

by . Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:55 pm

look who hunted assassins of both Very Happy

by Special Agent 47 Thu Oct 15, 2009 2:09 am

Well TBH all you Math guys just make my head hurt.

To Kenzu and WR, propaganda sucks, But I think you guys did well and I hope to see some more good fighting out of you guys. I find it alot more honorable then I really expected. 1 Question tho, why the info on Korruption? how does that factor into us and our war?

@ everyone else,,, come on guys, just smash something or someone. The math is killing me. We can make this fun and honorable Cool