No UU buying limits

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No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:04 pm

Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

Yes that's right, I don't plan on imposing any unit buying limits.
However there's gonna be a very nice thing that will help bridge the gap between large players growth and small players growth

In terms of game mechanics it will be explained as administrative effort. To maintain order and oversee the effective allocation of resources and workforce in a realm requires an administrative network. Obviously smaller realms are able more flexible concerning short term changes and are able to react accordingly faster and in more efficient ways (relative productivity). However larger realms, although requiring way much more effort in terms of administrating the allocation of resources, produce much more in absolute values (absolute productivity).

Look at it like a small stock broker can achieve a profit of 10k usd in a year with a relative return on investment being over 20-30%. A huge stock broker firm maybe achieves only 10-15% but its profits range in the millions.

Long story short, these two paragraphs boil down to this simple but effective formula (cookie for you if you can guess what it means):
y=((x^-1)/4)+0.75

Edit: Final formula will deviate from that. But the general meaning applies, the bigger you are the less actual income PER UNIT you get.


Last edited by Admin on Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:10 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by chaos on Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:55 pm

exponential decay in returns?

btw unles im wrong isnt this a slightly easier way to use it

y= (1/4X) + 0.75
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:36 pm

yeh it is wrong, cos your function is a linear one and wouldn't really make any sense in this problem Razz
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by chaos on Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:51 pm

but mine is us a reconfiguration of yours
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:00 pm

hardly lol
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by chaos on Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:40 pm

x^-1 = 1/x

(x^-1)/4 = (1/x)/4 = 1/4x
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:44 pm

bam, that's the reason i often did mistakes on my tests, was too lazy to read the whole text and only rushed through it Razz
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Mad King George on Tue Nov 04, 2008 6:34 pm

me know understand

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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Sandwalker on Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:06 am

actually chaos is right, although to avoid obscurity he should use the parenthesis differently, as such:

y= 1/(4x)+0.75



The bigger X is, the smaller the outcome, or Y. This is exponential yes, in that X has to grow A LOT to make Y drop. This means very fast initial hit from the administrative tax, but diminishing tax growth as size increases. The maximum administrative tax is 25% of turn income because the minimum value Y can reach is 0.75 when X is infinite, thus making 1/(4x) limit to 0. I don't know the wording for limits talk in english but those that know math get what I mean.

Now, I'm assuming this relates to kuwal income per worker unit.

If X=1, in the case of smaller accounts, the income payoff is Y=0.25+0.75=1.
Now, after a certain size cap (again, an assumption), X begins to grow according to your size. So if X becomes let's say 5, then your income Y will be 0.05+0.75=0.8 thus you make 0.8 of the normal amount due to your size, the difference of 0.2 being deducted as administrative taxes Smile .

Am I right ?

In a nutshell, an account making say 100bil per turn reaches a point where his administrative tax factor (X) is 5. At this point, his income per turn will drop to 80bil. It's a LOT, but in terms of percentages he only drops 20% and I assume this would be in an extreme size scenario.

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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:48 pm

what you said, although the real limit is going to go more like down to 50% and not 75
and i'll also make the drop in income as you get away from average army size to progress a bit slower.
and yes as you said, extreme size so if you're like 10-20 times larger than the average army then you will be very close to that limit, however i think people will appreciate such a limiter more than if for example i said that eventually people may not buy anymore units if they reach certain army size.

btw this will also get released in 1 week
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Dark Bahamut on Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:56 pm

Pi is equal to 3.14
*knows maths*

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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Renegade on Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:14 pm

Dark Bahamut wrote:Pi is equal to 3.14
*knows maths*

lmao
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by chaos on Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:58 pm

e^i(Pi) = -1

isnt it funny how 2 irrationa lnumbers and an imaginary number can be equal to -1 whenthey are placed like that

sorry bout spam btw

As for the growth limitations, i think that this is an excellent idea, however if you are doing it from an average, what determins this average, as it is constantly changing from growth, inactivity etc. Also will we be able to see what level of tax we are incurring?
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:53 pm

you will see at how much efficiency you generate income, the income details page.
and yes it's based off the average army size relative to your army size.

the average is calculated once per day (both the global and the personal), only registers people who logged in the last week and takes the interquartile range of those.

On a global scale once per day seems ok (even though atm the % growth in armies is very significant), on the personal scale i admit it might not be enough but only those who do sudden jumps will be affected (and only until the day is over)

and chaos:
I agree, that is a very beautiful equation Razz
I already liked it the first time i saw it
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Halaryel on Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:23 am

What if players untrain/hide units just before the day tick (for example into a canceled broker) then call their troops back just to have smaller administrative tax?

ban? ^^"""

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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:32 am

they are welcome to do that

untraining causes you to loose 3%
sending one way another 1%
then add training and untraining costs


I wonder who'll want to do that
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Sandwalker on Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:06 am

Admin wrote:
and chaos:
I agree, that is a very beautiful equation Razz
I already liked it the first time i saw it

Euler's identity may be famous but I've hated it all my life.

I prefer 0! = 1! = 1.

Now, if 0! = 1! then surely 0=1.

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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by chaos on Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:19 pm

true, many equations are mathematical errors due to the number 0 being completely rubbish. looking from a basic pov, it was created to fill the void between positive and negative numbers, as something had to exist between the two. however to create something means also creating rules, whcih for 0 can make little sense/no sense. take the folowing equation that mathematically correct but is flawed by the rules of 0.

XX-XX=XX-XX
(X-X)(X+X)=X(X-X)
X+X=X
2X=X
2=1

XX = X^2

0!=1! only works becuase you follow the pattern:

3! = 3x2x1
(3!)/3 = 2x1 = 2!

2! = 3!/3
> 2! = 2
1! = 2!/2
> 1! = 1
0! = 1!/1
> 0! = 1

1 more thing
Dark Bahamut wrote:Pi is equal to 3.14
*knows maths*

Pi song = Pi Song

back ontopic Razz.

Because the game is new and there are still a lot of 1 login people, any data, recorded in that week, used to create the admin costs will be sqewed in favour of the no/low income, rather than mid/high income ( generaly found with active players)

i know after a week or two this problem may be irrelevant however it wil cause problems and disuption in those days.
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:41 pm

that's not gonna be a problem
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:14 am

hnyways

coded and released, will take effect 00:00 servertime in 7 hours.
Only people above the average army size will be affected (for now)

Average army size is taken by taking the average of the middle 50% (interquartile range anyone?) players who logged in in the last 24 hours.

If you are infinitely larger than the average army, your realm will produce 40% of it's optimal production.


Last edited by Admin on Mon Jan 19, 2009 9:57 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Halaryel on Mon Jan 19, 2009 9:30 am

Welcome to the update, altough i will pretty bad with my new income ^^ but confort me into my growth pattern...

This will help the lower people to grow faster, i hope....

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Re: No UU buying limits

Post by Admin on Mon Jan 19, 2009 10:10 am

it will not help lower people grow faster as much as actually just slow down the larger players
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Re: No UU buying limits

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