PT case 1

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Case 1

Post by Admin on Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:13 pm

Case 1:

Account 1 sends
388k uu's
8.8 Bil kuwal
7000 turns
Account 2 sends
17.152 Bil kuwal
7000 turns

Account 1 uses kuwal to increase UP, doesn't build any other stats also has minimal army size
Account 2 is the larger account with 500k++ armysize
Account 1 is a tiny account

Timeframe: several months
UU rate paid: constant ~30 mil per k, give or take
Both accounts are from 1 home
Shared IP address reported

Account 1 has ultimate donator status.
NOT purchased by Account 2 but by third party.
Account 2 has normal donator status bought by himself

any further information will be given if good reasons are provided for its necessity.


Last edited by Admin on Wed Sep 23, 2009 2:22 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Haggis on Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:45 pm

Looking for further information

What sort of army size does account 1 have now? did he/she send all(or practically all) of their available UU to account 2?

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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:54 pm

yes, account 1 is down to several days worth of up in various unit types.
nothing considerable
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Sandwalker on Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:25 pm

------------
1
------------
account 1 is a feeder account used to increase UP at half price for the collective account 1+2.

The kuwal sent to account 1 was an investment to account 1's production capacity.

Account 2 is the main account. Account 1 can also be used to mass by proxy.
------------------------------------------------
------------
2
------------
Account 1's SS was purchased by account 2. In this case, the setup could be fair since he's not making nearly as much as I would ask for.
------------------------------------------------


1 vs 2 - VERY slim chance of case 2 having any merit.

It is either a multi or 2 people that know each other, one having been convinced by the other to "help out". Whichever it is, case 1 points to a feeder account.

Given the info in that post, case 1 is 90%-95% the case. If the IP is from Romania, consider it 110% chance of a feeder situation.

*Note: Same IP nails it.

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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:41 pm

added info on SS purchase
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Nomad on Tue Sep 22, 2009 11:01 pm

I would like to know what information or warnings are given to those who report shared IPs. That is a vital piece of information as far as I am concerned. As for how it looks I agree with sandwalkers quote below.
Sandwalker wrote:
It is either a multi or 2 people that know each other, one having been convinced by the other to "help out". Whichever it is, case 1 points to a feeder account.

One other possibility is that account 1 is away for an extended period of time, but still plans to stage a comeback at a later date, with help from account two, flip side is account 1 has a longer SS, so maybe he plans to do evil deeds with account 2, then ditch it and come back to account one.

I think the warnings issed, if any, when the shared IPs was reported should be enforced.
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:00 am

no specific warning or information is given other than the rules that apply at all times.

just that if you dont report automatically that you share an ip and i find it out, then i might be more suspicious than if you had reported it
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Nomad on Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:49 am

I think cleared rules should be explained, as my above mentioned senerio is valid. 1 account knows they wont play for XX months, so he gives resources to account 2, then upon return account 2 must repay all hes been given. I can see where thats an honest assumption, of course, the flip side is, many people know how to exploit an admins kindness or lack of clear warnings for certain practises.
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:01 am

hence you guys get a chance to set an example if you want.

Also i've been suggested a good punishment method.
giving a special race that suffers extra damage/more losses, less bonuses, for some duration.
Nice alternative to outright temporary and permanent banning
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Nomad on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:05 am

its useable, but its skewed

if no one touches them they get no punishment, but if someone wanted to be a real "pain in the,,,," they could sit on them and cause massive damage and farm them till the punishment is over.

I'm not against the idea, wouldnt even need a new race just give them a "plague" visible in the attack page.

like I said, its useable but the same punishment for 2 different people could be totally different from not even a punishment to catastrophy
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Re: PT case 1

Post by . on Wed Sep 23, 2009 7:54 am

i would say if you know the exact number of uu he has sold then you have let him return like 3/4 of to i don't know somewhere let it dissappear.

he made a profit of 2/3 on this that 66 % Very Happy it won't be a punishment to let him return 66 % that would be fair ! so i would ask for at least returning 75 % of it or more

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Re: PT case 1

Post by Kenzu on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:16 pm

IS the bigger account feeding the smaller one, or other way round?

ask the involved why one has received so many units for so little kuwal.
There might be legal reasons behind it.
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Wed Sep 23, 2009 2:22 pm

small account feeding big account
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Re: PT case 1

Post by FarleShadow on Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:25 pm

Or you could just block the transfer of anything between the two accounts.

I don't see this as 'cheating' rather its what I used to hear called 'Multi'ing' (Multiple accounts). Still lame, but easily corrected with a ban on transfering resources to each other.

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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:37 pm

FarleShadow wrote:Or you could just block the transfer of anything between the two accounts.

I don't see this as 'cheating' rather its what I used to hear called 'Multi'ing' (Multiple accounts). Still lame, but easily corrected with a ban on transfering resources to each other.
there's absolutely no point in even coding the ability of putting up such bans on trading between 2 accounts.
There's at least 2 other games that disallows trading between accounts who shared an IP.
Needless to say that me nor anyone else who played with relatives ever had problems in getting resources from account A to account B.

Now about 'cheating'. Cheating as used in this topic is any breach of rules, in effect someone cheating on others for their effort who abide by the rules. Feeding itself is illegal.

Personally I'd say these two account are cheating because either the smaller account is inactive and just siphons away the resources to the larger account (assuming we're talking 2 people using 2 accounts, so no 'multying') which is illegal according SPECIFIC RULES #1.
Or we're talking 1 person who somehow got hold of the second account (bought or having been given, whatever) which means that person is breaking GENERAL RULE #1.
So pick one
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Fri Sep 25, 2009 2:40 pm

so anyways i'd like to conclude this case, so my suggested punishment is as follows:

removal of 2 times the excess units received by Account 2
banning of account 1
account 2 being granted a unique race for a week where they receive:
-10 points to all stats
-no bonus whatsoever in researching anything

Potentially maybe harsher sentence than necesary but I feel an example has to be made of. A few more of those and people will learn to draw the line very quickly or suffer the consequences
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Disco_Vader on Fri Sep 25, 2009 3:13 pm

This is a war game, perhaps an appropriate punishment should be violent. How about a public stoning (massing) at a designated time for a designated duration? Perhaps the Alliances can choose their massers for the punishment.
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Fri Sep 25, 2009 3:45 pm

Disco_Vader wrote:This is a war game, perhaps an appropriate punishment should be violent. How about a public stoning (massing) at a designated time for a designated duration? Perhaps the Alliances can choose their massers for the punishment.
not gonna happen, no one wants to waste their resources, although i could give them out like a government grant, it's still a pointless idea as eventually someone will break the rules who has nothing to destroy
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Re: PT case 1

Post by . on Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:20 pm

removal of 2 times the excess units received by Account 2

so just 100 % of all he recieved from the account!

then actually the money he payed for it will be the punishment ?

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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:51 pm

souldog wrote:
removal of 2 times the excess units received by Account 2
so just 100 % of all he recieved from the account!
then actually the money he payed for it will be the punishment ?
no, punishment in uu removal hurts more than kuwal that has already been sent
If you would need to pay 1$ for a bus ticked, but the penalty for not having one would only be 1$, then you'd be better off not buying the ticket and worst case scenario should you actually get checked, pay the 1$ fine.
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Sandwalker on Fri Sep 25, 2009 5:04 pm

Admin wrote:so anyways i'd like to conclude this case, so my suggested punishment is as follows:

removal of 2 times the excess units received by Account 2
banning of account 1
account 2 being granted a unique race for a week where they receive:
-10 points to all stats
-no bonus whatsoever in researching anything

Potentially maybe harsher sentence than necesary but I feel an example has to be made of. A few more of those and people will learn to draw the line very quickly or suffer the consequences

very good decision. Couldn't agree with you more Razz

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Re: PT case 1

Post by . on Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:22 pm

account 2 is the small one not ? Very Happy

well it is a hard punishment but a good example indeed be warned

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Re: PT case 1

Post by Kenzu on Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:27 pm

Isnt it possible he bought it off someone?
If not, then the offender should be punished as mentioned before.
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Re: PT case 1

Post by Admin on Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:51 pm

Kenzu wrote:Isnt it possible he bought it off someone?
If not, then the offender should be punished as mentioned before.
each of the trades was uu for kuwal, rate of 1:30,000 give or take.
rate remained the same from now till several months back
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Re: PT case 1

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