WR is open to negotiations with TIE

2 things to know before we can start:

1. Since TIE wants Kenzu removed from WR leadership, WR wants Ian removed from TIE leadership.

2. Massings from TIE members *which Ian acknowledged were happening* would have to cease. WR would take no action against TIE members IF and WHEN Ian steps down and the attacks stop.

Spoiler:

3. TIE would need to "come out of hiding" meaning removing the "Secret" from their alliance.

4. TIE would need to appoint 1 diplomat (maximum of 2 diplomats) who has(have) the authority to make the changes and approve any peace treaty without having to check with their new leader.


Once these consessions are met and made, we can move forward with a peace treaty between WR and TIE.

*Post removed and returned to its original place as it was moved without my permission.*

"Statistically, you will almost certainly emerge victorious when assaulting an ill-maintained fortress with an incompetent commander. You must strive to make your fight useful."

- Jenit Sulla, Lady General Universe of the Imperium -

made me lol.

I request that whom ever is moving my posts from one area to another STOP doing it.

You want to start a new topic that's fine, but don't move my post's.

Kismet wrote:2 things to know before we can start:

1. Since TIE wants Kenzu removed from WR leadership, WR wants Ian removed from TIE leadership.

2. Massings from TIE members *which Ian acknowledged were happening* would have to cease. WR would take no action against TIE members IF and WHEN Ian steps down and the attacks stop.

Spoiler:

3. TIE would need to "come out of hiding" meaning removing the "Secret" from their alliance.

4. TIE would need to appoint 1 diplomat (maximum of 2 diplomats) who has(have) the authority to make the changes and approve any peace treaty without having to check with their new leader.


Once these consessions are met and made, we can move forward with a peace treaty between WR and TIE.

1. Well lets be honest here. Ian and Kenzu can not be thrown in the same boat. Ian simply reacts to the trouble. Kenzu tends to be the center of it. I think 90% of the server can agree with this. Outside perspectives that i have gathered find ian easy to work with and negotiate with. Most issues with every other alliance are resolved in under 15 minutes except for anything dealing with Kenzu. Kenzu's actions created a negative view on WR as a whole which in return has forced relations with WR very hostile and more difficult then need be.

Scenario: A player farms a member of the alliance and breaks farming policy
Ian's response
First, Message player that broke the policy and ask them to not farm outside the policy again.
Second, Player responds, Sure no problem or have them increase their defense
Next, Ian will not respond to the "sure no problem" but if the person replies saying have them increase their defense he will issue a threat saying stay within the policy and do nothing unless the person breaks policy again. If that happens a 2nd message will be sent and pending response player will be dealt with.

Kenzu's response
Kick things off by posting on forums and say policy was broken and "demand" compensation without messaging the player even 1 time.
Players response. F you
Kenzu mass player or issue a state of war.

Kenzus response is slowly changing but we cant all forget how kenzu was towards other people be4 TIE intervened. Kenzu was responsible for massing many smaller members over simple farming issues without evening contacting the person before attacking them, seriously what kind of diplomacy do you think WR was running before?


2. Ian knew of the attacks. Every1 in TIE knew of the attacks. People post their "accomplishments" on the forums for all to read after the fact. No messages or orders were sent out til well today people organized.
3. Already planned on doing that
4. Me. appointed as i was ending this post. Kismet you have my info. Also i prefer not to speak public ally as everything said gets blown out of proportion. If you want to talk to me message me on msn. sethmartzen@live.com

I ll keep this simple.

World Republic as it stands is currently not open to negotiation as far as The Imperium Empire is concerned.

The Imperium's demands have always been simple - stop spying on us and stop slandering us, stop picking on small players. No more manipulating other alliances i.e. backing one side untill the "other" side is neutralised, then switching sides to back the "other" side to break the power of your previous ally.

World Republic's failure to comply with the above points is what caused the first war. Even then we got peace - only for World Republic to breach it, thus declaring war on The Imperium Empire.

All of the above failures on the part of World Republic mean The Imperium Empire is no longer open to diplomacy - this is no longer a peaceful negotiation to avoid war.

Simply put: All that is left to negotiate is World Republic's surrender. Below are T.I.E's demands:

- World Republic officially and publically surrenders on the Aderan Wars forum.

- World Republic officially acknowledges their past wrongs, and apologises to Aderan War's community as a whole.

- World Republic agree's to NEVER slander, manipulate or attempt to infiltrate another alliance again. Failure to do so will result in war.

- World Republic will remove Kenzu from World Republic.

- World Republic agree's to take full responsibility for *any* of its members actions in the future - and thus bare the consequences.

These are T.I.E's terms in order for us to cease our attacks upon World Republic. The longer World Republic leaves it, and the more World Republic resists - the stricter the terms... we ll start adding compensation demands into the terms.

For everyone else: If The Imperium Empire is really so evil, ask yourselves why it is that only World Republic players + rflash (who fought in the last war on WR's side) have ever been massed by The Imperium Empire - despite our obvious power and ability to do so.

If we are what Kenzu and World Republic claim, then why is it that noone else has experienced any hostile attempts from T.I.E. Why is it none of you have experienced bullying from T.I.E? Why is it no other alliances have fallen at our hands?

Action's speak louder than words. Look at each of your personal experienced when dealing with T.I.E - and draw your own conclusions.

World Republic will surrender or burn for their hostility against T.I.E. Those are the only options on the table.

Hahahahahahaha was it just me or did it look like WR were trying to set the terms?

Unless you counter-strike with a devastating blow so that we are brought to our knees i suggest you leave the setting of the terms to those who are doing the killing so far.

On a side note - Ian has never led us into a catastrophic war, infact in over the 2 years ive served the Commonwealth/Imperium we have never issued a surrender. So why would we remove him from leader when hes obviously doing a good job?

Plus there is a thing called loyalty... your welcome to fight back under Kenzu's banner but please its deeply insulting for you to even suggest we betray Ian.

Hai-Shulud wrote:infact in over the 2 years ive served the Commonwealth/Imperium we have never issued a surrender.

I did make you change your alliance name! No worries, I knew it was only tactical, I didn't want the war either.

*puts on cheerleader outfit*
*mental note*Lay of the twinkies

Roots for Ian/TIE

As a neutral, demands are harsh.

Wars are fought by TWO sides, this is ONE side attacking. Not a war.

Still TIE have failed on that front.
(Referring to Sara, whom SA-47 AND Ian TRIED to destroy)

Personally, people could get further, if they only asked or made proposals to the ones 'they are clearly beating up and winning in a fight'.

Demands are said after the other gives up to the power of the first.

As you've stated already, WR has not bowed.

Therefore I ask you to request or propose and NOT demand.

I agree that TIE should admit some of the wrong doing.

I was speaking to kenzu last night and asked what else he would want from TIE instead of ian being removed from leader as there is literally no chance of that happening. IAN and KENZU are not even close to being in the same situation. Kenzu never gave me a direct response. Said he will get back to me.

I feel that TIE asking the leader of the alliance being removed is not asking for much in comparison to all the trouble that was caused by this single person. Imagine Kenzu was not leading WR early on this war would have never happened in the first place. The whole reason TIE intervened at all in WR was because of Kenzu massing smaller players when they would do "1v1" with a member of his alliance.

I will discuss things over with a few people to see if i can work out a temporary removal as leader for Kenzu instead of a permanent exile.


So of of the requests by WR, TIE has complied with 2 of the 4. the 2nd request will be done as we progress and get something done. And request 1 is declined for the reasons stated in previous posts by myself.

GeIveI2aL wrote:

Still TIE have failed on that front.
(Referring to Sara, whom SA-47 AND Ian TRIED to destroy)

Doesn't belong on this section. If you bring the war information to the diplomatic section we are in the same boat as last time.

Vesper wrote:

GeIveI2aL wrote:

Still TIE have failed on that front.
(Referring to Sara, whom SA-47 AND Ian TRIED to destroy)

Doesn't belong on this section. If you bring the war information to the diplomatic section we are in the same boat as last time.

Fair enough, can't say much against that or will try against that.

Won't happen again.

Also on that front, let's not have people rooting for other people.

Vesper wrote:So of of the requests by WR, TIE has complied with 2 of the 4. the 2nd request will be done as we progress and get something done.

it's not worth logging into my other account but still need to ask this as a subjective and biased opinion....

But doesn't it kinda defeat the point of diplomacy if there's a demand to stop the massings and you continue thinking it will help the negotiations considering it's not actually necessary to show that you mean business and that you can actually do it (besides the odd one or two massings to just set an example)

Again, is it just me or am I really failing to understand how some things work.
It's just the way the statement is worded that confuses me, if it were something along the line of "2nd request will be done as soon as we blow off the steam that kenzu made us accumulate over the last 6 months" then I'd have no further questions.

Admin wrote:

Vesper wrote:So of of the requests by WR, TIE has complied with 2 of the 4. the 2nd request will be done as we progress and get something done.

it's not worth logging into my other account but still need to ask this as a subjective and biased opinion....

But doesn't it kinda defeat the point of diplomacy if there's a demand to stop the massings and you continue thinking it will help the negotiations considering it's not actually necessary to show that you mean business and that you can actually do it (besides the odd one or two massings to just set an example)

Again, is it just me or am I really failing to understand how some things work.
It's just the way the statement is worded that confuses me, if it were something along the line of "2nd request will be done as soon as we blow off the steam that kenzu made us accumulate over the last 6 months" then I'd have no further questions.

I rate that question , and I look forward to Vesper's answer.

Admin wrote:
Again, is it just me or am I really failing to understand how some things work.
It's just the way the statement is worded that confuses me, if it were something along the line of "2nd request will be done as soon as we blow off the steam that kenzu made us accumulate over the last 6 months" then I'd have no further questions.

6 Months eh? I was told 3 months.

Hmm... strange, I wasn't even on AW 6months ago... well my memory doesnt recall it and I get punished. Fantastic.

GeIveI2aL wrote:6 Months eh? I was told 3 months.

well 3 months or 6 months, no difference. I dont keep track of things that dont interest me too much

GeIveI2aL wrote:
Hmm... strange, I wasn't even on AW 6months ago... well my memory doesnt recall it and I get punished. Fantastic.

Yo Shaggy, give the whole "wasn't me!" defense a rest. I don't see anyone swayed by it.

Dude seriously STOP CRYING there is literally no one here with any sympathy.

Ill address something with honesty here -

TIE really was trying for peace - I wasnt, infact ive been pushing for war since Kenzu first opened his trap, sadly Ian knows me very well from dune and knows that i enjoy these games ONLY when there are wars so i always vote for war - however the rest of TIE are very much similar to yourself GeIveI2aL as in much more interested in growing in peace. So the majority decided to pursue peace and that was attempted best we could. Im not gonna lie i tried my best to resist the peace talks but i didnt need to try very hard ( for that i thank you Kenzu )

Here is where the difference between our average Jo and you -GeIveI2aL - is. They decided to back their leader and his decisions and fight for our principles. And we have asked them to donate quite a lot to the war effor and guess what - NO ONE HAS COMPLAINED! grow a pair and stop whining!

Admin - There is a lot of steam to let off! WR are welcome to wait until we finish blowing the steam off for peace talks are they can start now with people like Vesper who can hold their steam.

Reply to admin.

I said 2nd request will be dealt with pending progress because TIE has 1 request.

I agreed to half of WRs requests and will go to 75% if they agree to our 1 requests. Why should I do everything WR asks when they have failed to do a single thing i have asked? I also feel that with the massings occuring there are 2 outcomes.

First outcome will be Kenzu realizes he will never step down as leader at which point TIE can fully arm and sit on him

OR

Second outcome will be that Kenzu realizes TIE will not stop hitting him until re resigns as leader at which point he will step down.

ALSO last time TIE decided to lay off of WR and try only diplomacy it back fired. Why would we take the knife out a beast that we know full well will jump at the chance to bite you?

Hai-Shulud wrote:Dude seriously STOP CRYING there is literally no one here with any sympathy.

Ill address something with honesty here -

TIE really was trying for peace - I wasnt, infact ive been pushing for war since Kenzu first opened his trap, sadly Ian knows me very well from dune and knows that i enjoy these games ONLY when there are wars so i always vote for war - however the rest of TIE are very much similar to yourself GeIveI2aL as in much more interested in growing in peace. So the majority decided to pursue peace and that was attempted best we could. Im not gonna lie i tried my best to resist the peace talks but i didnt need to try very hard ( for that i thank you Kenzu )

Here is where the difference between our average Jo and you -GeIveI2aL - is. They decided to back their leader and his decisions and fight for our principles. And we have asked them to donate quite a lot to the war effor and guess what - NO ONE HAS COMPLAINED! grow a pair and stop whining!

Admin - There is a lot of steam to let off! WR are welcome to wait until we finish blowing the steam off for peace talks are they can start now with people like Vesper who can hold their steam.

Stop the direct assault on me thanks.

If this is just 1 of your members TIE, am sorry for you. War mongrel which knows nothing of having peace or quiet.

Crying, no-one is crying.
Am here trying to sort or help to sort this mess out.
Alot of information has to be read which makes both Kenzu AND TIE look bad.

All this even after I got massed but am holding no grudges.

GeIveI2aL wrote:Stop the direct assault on me thanks.

If this is just 1 of your members TIE, am sorry for you. War mongrel which knows nothing of having peace or quiet.

Crying, no-one is crying.
Am here trying to sort or help to sort this mess out.
Alot of information has to be read which makes both Kenzu AND TIE look bad.

All this even after I got massed but am holding no grudges.

Hahahahahaha again you provide me amusement

1stly - If i choose to have a go at you thats my choice, if i step out of line in the use of my language im sure admin will take care of it but apart from that I "the individual" reserve the right to say what i want

2ndly - I am indeed a "War Mongrel" as you say and a proud one at that. You are aware that it is called AderanWARS and that the majority of functions in this game involve some sort of killing or stealing from someone else's account right? So what your saying is that TIE should be ashamed of me coz i use the game for its primary purpose? LOL! Please spare me your crap, the sole reason i play this game is the satisfaction i get from massing other people. You can judge me all you want but thats how i like to play. Theres a reason why im on the TIE SHC, my cry for war and blood-letting isnt always mindless, but you know what im happy to mass people like you just for "fun".

Your attempts at "sort or help this mess" are worst than useless so far - your all talk and no action
Thats why there are 10 different topic about this
Thats why WR are getting massed right now
Thats why Kenzu hasn't owned up to anything and attempted to do the right thing for the sake of WR
And now youve pissed me off which is a shame coz im going to take it out on some poorly defended WR accounts ( they can thank you for that )

Its not rocket science - There are 2 options
A- You agree with what Kenzu did in which case we dont like you either and are going to mass all of you and sit on WR
B- You disagree with what Kenzu did so you remove him from the alliance and we sit on Kenzu till we are bored

It really is black and white as that!!! But youve made a right pigs meal of it so i suggest you keep quiet now as well and leave it to Kismet who so far seems to be the only one getting the picture and not cheesing people off!

Admin wrote:

GeIveI2aL wrote:6 Months eh? I was told 3 months.

well 3 months or 6 months, no difference. I dont keep track of things that dont interest me too much

Obviously it interest you enough to post, funny how Kenzu topics have that effect on you.

No offense to anyone on here, but as this is a prelude to negotiations (considering there are points that need to be addressed on both sides), I ask that only those with the authority to do so (as in leaders/diplomats only) post in this thread.

In my opinion, it can get out of hand very quickly with others posting as well.

@Vesper: I'm on my netbook and don't have msn running - as I said before in another thread, harsh Christmas. I live next door to my father, so if the admin checks, my ip is sometimes the same as @ home, but I've got a pretty powerful wireless network and sometimes it overrides my father's wireless. It would be easy enough to run home and type in an answer, but for now I'll work on getting MSN running on the netbook. Sorry Seth... as soon as possible, I promise! If I can't remember the password for the account you have, I'll send you my other msn and hope I have that pass too


On the resquests I first listed:
Kenzu requested the same of Ian that TIE is demanding of him. I think to show what a decision it can be.

I think I explained about the attacks: it'd be nice to know if those were coming from TIE members, so making your alliance "not" secret shouldn't be that big a deal.

The request for the attacks to stop would be good faith on TIE's part.

No offense Ian, but you do flip/flop on the whole open to negotiations and peace treaty. One day you're open to it, the next you say absolutely not.

SA47: I have no problem dealing with you as diplomat, G might, but I do not. I think on a lot of points we see eye to eye, just as Vesper and I do. I think we can find a common ground to at least sit and build a fire and smoke a peace pipe at least :p (joking on that, but imagine the image!)

Ian, I have left it open for you to message me at the very least and I've not heard word 1 from you at this point. If it's because you don't like me for some reason, you might want to consider having someone else (diplomat/s) discuss anything with me. If you are so agreed, please post that and then post nothing further since this would be a negotiation thread.... Kenzu won't be posting here either. IF you're acting as TIE's diplomat..... and won't even talk to me, you really should consider another to do the negotiations.

By asking for a diplomat that can make the decision for the alliance in agreeing to any terms, that would be important so there wouldn't be such a delay. The diplomat would need that authority.