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Peace Treaty between World Republic and Imperium

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Post by Special Agent 47 Wed Dec 23, 2009 12:52 pm

Kismet wrote:
I hope you're not asking for defectors or spies Laughing
No I was asking for a DIPLOMAT to come forward, same as I did during the war when it took days/weeks for no one to appear and for WR to launch a second wave of attacks as I sat begging for a diplomat. I am sure the smilie means that was said in jest, but I/we are not in a humorous mood.

I come here only to report Kismet has made contact with myself, and is speaking well and trying to find resolve in a manner I personally find very acceptable. Everything she has asked of me I complied with to the best of my ability and will continue to do so. I have also given Kismet my list of ideas as she is the WR Diplomat.

Thank You Kismet for accepting the Diplomat position, and finally coming forward.


Last edited by Special Agent 47 on Wed Dec 23, 2009 12:52 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : punctuation)
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Post by Kismet Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:21 pm

Just to clarify, I was teasing with the comment I made SA47 Smile

It was in a sad attempt to lighten things up just a touch, for that I do apologize.

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Post by ian Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:50 pm

Kismet wrote:Oh wow......... WTH happens in 2 days?

Before I start with specific messages, I will state this.

I have messaged Kenzu and asked him to do a few things that should help to resolve some of these issues. One is changing the recruitment message. There's nothing against recruiting new people, just things should be handled a little more tactfully and without mentioning TIE or anyone WR doesn't see as an ally. On that note as well, IF the new person comes back and ASKS questions about alliances, we will do our best to keep it neutral and friendly. We expect much the same. However, we also expect that we won't be "set-up" as in getting friends to join AW just to see what kind of recruitment message is sent out from WR/Kenzu.

Ian, starting with you since I have your quotes handy......


ian wrote:I m gonna clarify some things here:

The Imperium Empire's official stance is we are currently neutral with World Republic, as in... neither at war nor at peace with them.

Any hostile actions conducted against WR are by TIE individuals only -likely prevoked by Kenzu's pig-ignorant attitude and hostility towards TIE.

While TIE is actively discouraging attacks against WR (i.e. we are advising against them), given the general hostility towards us from WR, we will no longer be actively or officially ordering them to stop.

Should things escalate however (such as indiscriminate attacks upon TIE members by *any* World Republic members), World Republic can expect a swift and brutal OFFICIAL Imperium Empire response - and in so doing an response which will have the full resource and military backing off the empire as a whole - compared to just angered individuals as may possibly be the case in the forseeable future.

For WR - there was a time i was prepared to reign in our members to stop them retaliating against your unwarranted, unfair and obvious aggression and hostility towards us. I m no longer prepared to do so.

Right now i m still prepared to hold back on an official TIE declaration of war however (which would mean ALL of TIE working together against you)... but your next couple of moves/ decisions/ responses will influence me heavily. If you value your accounts - you ll think very hard and very carefully as to what these will be.


ian wrote:The second choice means any thoroughly pissed of TIE INDIVIDUALS are now free (since TIE leadership won't be stopping them) to start targetting World Republic at their *own* initiative with their *own* resources - along with any non TIE members who feel like joining in. How they organise themselves, fight and fund their little war is not TIE's concern - they are a group of friends and individuals annoyed enough to take matters into their own hands.

First, since TIE is secret, any attack or massing that WR receives at this point would point towards TIE since we don't know (I don't know) who is in TIE and who isn't. People can say on the forums that they're no longer in TIE, but with the alliance being secret, there's no proof of that. ALSO, "indiscriminate attacks upon TIE members" - again, you're set to "Secret" and there are a number of people already not in an alliance or part of another "secret" alliance - so how would any WR or (O) member really know? Sorry, but I don't have a list of who is in TIE and who has "left" or been "removed." Right now, WR would still be following the "Farming Rules" and not massing anyone.

Secondly, are you saying long-term loyal members of TIE who have recently "left" just so they can attack WR/Kenzu/(O) won't be welcomed back into the fold AFTER they've massed WR/Kenzu/(O) and then compensated or "assisted" in rebuilding what they lost?

Thirdly, since you're so big on spies, are you also stating that you have absolutely ZERO spies in WR or (O)? Just curious at this point, since you've stated that WR had a spy during all of this, but I don't remember you say you don't at all. You've seemed to completely step around that actually, so I'm rather curious as you've made such a deal out of this.


**

I really do want a peace from this. I would like to negotiate a peace treaty with you Ian. A whole lot less complicated than the previous one.

Vesper & SA47, I've messaged you back in-game but have heard nothing from Ian. I know there are a lot of issues. I'm hoping I can get them in a way that I can work with and get some resolution. I have sent Ian a message in-game. Hopefully, this will get us somewhere Smile

Positive thinking!

First off i appreciate your carm approach to this.

You are right regarding the recruitment message - there is absolutely zero need for a message to be hostile to another alliance. As for being set up.... you actually weren't set up by TIE - one of our individual members used his initiative to arrange for the whole thing.... but neither myself or the rest of TIE had any idea about it. Eithier way... can you blame him given what that set-up uncovered? Without the set-up, Kenzu/ WR would never have been caught saying what they were saying... and i d ask you consider the bigger picture:

Had that recruitment continued, a number of likely consequences would have happened:

1.) World Republic's membership would have been artificially increased due to at least some new players recieving those sort of messages joining out of fear - fear resulting from a exaggeration and outright misrepresentation of facts concerning TIE, or the "peaceful" and "fair" nature of World Republic. Its entirely possible some of the players who recieved those sort of messages may well under normal circumstances (i.e. normal recruitment messages) not have joined World Republic - yet when faced with fear... would have done.

2.) Those who didn't join WR, after recieving that message - may nonetheless have taken what was being told them under advisement... which in turn would impact the way and method which they deal with T.I.E or its members in the future - very likely negatively for TIE.

In 2 or 3months worth of that sort of recruiting going on, who knows how many previous-new players, but now medium to large players, would fear, hate or be unsure about TIE? That sort of aggressive policy could not be permitted to continue from World Republic.

Right... now onto your points:

Point 1: I m not saying anything of the sort. I think i ve made it clear that since the peace treaty no longer exists, there is now *nothing* stopping individuals in TIE from targetting World Republic members for personal reasons - much like they would with any other people/ alliances they may have issues sufficient reasons with. This is not a TIE directed or organised offensive - we are staying out of it.... its just now that the peace treaty no longer exists, World Republic is just as susceptible to personal wars as the rest of the server.

I.e. if a player in another alliance bad-mouted, insulted, threatened or generally really annoyed a TIE player... its likely that that TIE player would declare a 1 vs 1, 1 vs. 3, 1 vs. alliance or whatever. Before with the peace treaty inplace - individuals were honour bound (forced by TIE's leadership) to obey that treaty regardless of personal issues or feelings. Now without a peace treaty - they are free to do as they see fit provided their actions are justified.

In this regard, consequently - since WR really has gone above and beyond its objective of prevoking, annoying and insulting TIE - TIE individuals have sufficient reason (as far as TIE's leadership is concerned) to declare personal wars against WR... much like they would against anyone else who has insulted/ prevoked/ been aggressive to them.

TIE is not organised or coordinating attacks on WR... it is merely individuals (some individuals who aren't even in TIE)... that said, individuals who target WR will NOT be removed from TIE... since they are not breaking any rules.

Consequently, i think point 1 is mainly irrelevant. By indiscriminate... i mean if WR starts massing/ assaulting/ hurting players who have done nothing hostile to World Republic... so knowing whether or not those players are TIE doesn't actually matter... as it means your targetting innocent players if indiscriminate attacks does become an issue - something which would result in war between TIE and World Republic...even if the innocent player was not a TIE player (we d intervene to stop WR picking on innocent players).

Point 2 is also completely relevant - given TIE members don't have to leave TIE to target WR.

3.) I m stating The Imperium Empire has no spies in World Republic.

As for what TIE's demands will be if we are ever to re-establish diplomatic links, it is simple:

We want Kenzu gone from World Republic with no more links to WR. We want him exiled. Most of WR claims they have no idea about Kenzu's actions, and should not take responsibility for them... if that is so - then Kenzu should be removed from WR. As long as he is a member, we ll hold the rest of WR to account for his actions.

If this is achieved... it will go at least some way to repairing some of the bridges which have been burnt between TIE and World Republic, and we would *possibly* be open to some sort of arrangement with regard to a peace treaty. Untill then... given the level of distrust we now have for Kenzu, and given the level of influence and power Kenzu has over World Republic... we can not afford to trust WR in any agreement.

That said, i ll at least be happy to discuss the issue's with you - but don't expect any "official" results to be achieved while Kenzu has any links to WR.
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Post by Kismet Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:54 pm

One note to add here.

Last I'd heard, WR had the 135% farming policy. That has now been changed.

The 3 tier policy has been put forth to WR membership and are expected to use it. Some members are still new and I've told them to use a covert mission first to make 100% sure the person they're about to farm is within those boundaries. If you see a failed attempt, understand that even though they might have been told it would fail, some are still going to try - usually without thinking (the covert mission, not the attack mission).

I've also asked WR membership to let me know if they're farmed and it doesn't conform to the 3 tier policy. WR membership shouldn't be singled out when most all alliances I've talked to in the last 3 days are using this 3 tier policy.

Simple information, nothing more.

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Post by Kismet Wed Dec 23, 2009 7:07 pm

Ian,

I could quote everything, but I think the quoting has gotten us to page 29, nearly page 30 of this because some posts are so huge and there's simply no need to quote everything unless it was to make sure you were quoted so you couldn't change anything without it being noticed. I'm not worried about that.

That being said, besides the new farming policy I've instituted within WR (we were at the 135% one before), there are other changes coming. I am not saying we're kicking out Kenzu! Kenzu started WR and while his recruitment message wasn't good, he was trying to recruit. I've sent him messages about the way of recruiting (I think I've already stated that earlier as well). He's done a lot for a large number of WR members, myself included. His advice on how to build up and what to build, why I couldn't see things or what I was doing were and are invaluable. He does have an extremely good handle on how the game itself works.

Sometimes people get hot headed and lose it at one point or another. Once or twice done should be forgiven. I also understand that constantly provoking others tends to get someone hated very quickly. Some people's attitudes/demeanor/general personality are just like that. The road to Hell is paved with the best intentions. Wink

I'm not asking you to forgive Kenzu everything said or done. I am asking you to keep an open mind right now and allow me to work with you to help protect the current (and future) members of my alliance. I've said for a long time that war is expensive. Farming can be very expensive as well (lol). I really just don't want to see innocent members who joined the alliance because they were looking for and found good advice massed simply because they're WR. People on here have stated that if someone is in WR, it's because they're following Kenzu and agree with him without question. I ask you to consider that some are here because of other members (and leadership) and their assistance/protection and not simply because Kenzu's leader of WR.

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Post by Special Agent 47 Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:49 pm

Kismet wrote:Just to clarify, I was teasing with the comment I made SA47 Smile

It was in a sad attempt to lighten things up just a touch, for that I do apologize.
Do not apologize Kismet, the few messages passed between us has been enough to lighten my disposition greatly. Some humor can and will go along way. That was recognized as humor, I just wasn't very humorous when I responded. All good Kismet, I'm just glad to see you here, active, and working to resolve the issue. You have made points, and more importantly you have accepted points. something Kenzu does not seem to have the ability to do.

Kismet wrote:
Spoiler:

I have never myself known of a breach in the farming policy that wasnt handle fairly quickly and with a great deal of ease. That's both sides. As far as I know this is not an issue, nor has it been, and I honestly don't see it becoming one.

As for your stance on Kenzu, and you want to protect the "innocent" of WR, might I suggest you take drastic measures to protect them. Possibly temporary action but take some form of action. Yes you have talked, very well I might add. Yes you have actually listened, something Kenzu refused to do. As of yet no action has been taken of any kind tho.

Heck, either call WR to arms and make your stand, or maybe you should ask Kenzu how much he really cares for WR. Maybe he cares enough to leave WR to save it. At least until some resolve can be found. At least till some tempers and discontent subside. At least until you can put a muzzle on Kenzu. Maybe you should ask WR if this hellstorm Kenzu has brought on WR is worth keeping Kenzu in the alliance. You also have the possible option I gave you concerning refugees. You have options Kismet. Its not easy making decisions, but some action is going to be needed because you been talking 2 or 3 days, we been talk 2 or 3 months. Its way past talking for us.

Believe what you will, in all honesty. NO ONE, especially not me, wants to see WR destroyed. We don't want to see it disbanded, nor crushed. All we want is for kenzu to shut up, and for us to Earn what ever reputation we get from the community. Not have Kenzu's personal hate shoved down everyone throat in fits of lies and deceit.
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Post by ian Wed Dec 23, 2009 11:55 pm

Again.. good point SA47.

Kismet, you seem like your a capable leader and you look like you have the best of intentions.

As such, i need to reassure you on at least one point: If The Imperium Empire is going to attack - we won't need a justification to do it. We are past caring about or needing justifications. That means if one of your members accidentally breaches out farming policy... it won't make a shred bit of difference on whether or not we ll attack WR. This is something i fear you and WR have yet to grasp - TIE's decisions are made looking at the bigger picture (i.e. everything which has happened the last 3months) - not on some small insignificant affair... all the small affairs merely do is tip the balance one way or another - the final cherry on the cake.

The fact we haven't *yet* attacked World Republic as a united force, perhaps speaks volumes about our intentions, or at least about our waning and near-death hopes for a peaceful settlement which doesn't involve WR manipulating, backstabbing, conducting espionage, being hostile or generally any of the other unpleasantness which has been conducted in the last 3months. This hope is near death, and currently being artificially kept alive... and its upon this that the next chapter will be drawn.

Now... there is one way World Republic *MIGHT* be able to avoid future attacks from TIE individuals, as well as diverting the possible conflict between TIE itself and World Republic.

This is simple:

We want Kenzu stripped off any leadership role in World Republic, and never allowed to resume such a role. We want him exempted from *any* future agreements (such as peace). We want a public statement of acknowledgement from WR that they ll take full responsibility for any actions or statements taken by Kenzu, and we want an public statement that never again will World Republic attempt to infiltrate another alliance, manipulate that alliance or generally be hostile to that alliance. We want you to ensure Kenzu never again can be allowed to cause conflict or tension between our alliances.

If your prepared to agree to these terms - i ll be prepared to put it to a vote to TIE on whether we should readopt the previously breached peace treaty.

IF the peace treaty is readopted, it means TIE members will cease their individual attacks, as well as TIE itself being bound to the treaty.

Eithier way - World Republic with Kenzu in anything even resembling a position of leadership, is heading into a whole world of hurt right about now - and already TIE individuals are volunteering to turn World Republic's "Evil bullying, aggressive, nasty uncompromising TIE" fantasy into a reality.... and the situation is getting to the point where it will be impossible to tell whether or not TIE officially will end up joining in the role playing.

Its just a shame Kenzu couldn't shut up... so many lies, so much slander - now its time to give Kenzu/ WR a taste of the *real* implications of having a TIE which is how they ve described/ visualised/ fantasied/ told people about. Only then *maybe*, just *maybe* - if WR survives it - will Kenzu and WR be able to tell the difference between the distortions + slander being spread, and the actual reality... and maybe, just maybe - the lies and slander might stop.

Eithier way, i m all out of diplomacy, and fully loaded with guns. What the next step is, now rests with WR.
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Post by Kismet Thu Dec 24, 2009 4:17 am

Ian and SA47, I appreciate you both being as open as you have been. As you've both stated, there are some major decisions that have to be made.

Also, I appreciate being given the time to not only get to know each of you and a few others from TIE, but to get a handle on everything that's been going on.

Ian, I don't want the same peace treaty, I'll state that up front. That one to me was entirely too complicated. I won't say I'm easy, but I compromise and I do my best to see that any treaty would be fair to both parties (alliances). During the time of re-negotiation, we'd just have a simple cease-fire but I don't see that it would take long.

I think you and I are closer in time-zones if you're in MA/east coast.

There are other issues that have come up with other alliances as well, not just WR/TIE. I'm working on those as well, so I apologize for it seeming like I'm dragging my feet on this. I'm really not. There are a lot of things to take into consideration on our side. Kenzu's been strong about the members of WR and I really have no intention of throwing him under the bus. I'm not the only one that has a hard decision to make in this - Kenzu does as well. It would be his decision to step down or leave. I'm not asking that of him right now either.

SA47: I understand and realize the great potential of some of the suggestions you made to me. Those are being taken into consideration as well. Share them with Ian if you haven't already. My position in WR is 2ic. I'm the official diplomat. I have to be vague sometimes, but I won't lie, mislead or deliberately send you in another direction. Not to you or anyone else.

--

This is a game. I understand that. I also understand that if someone can't trust your word, you're pretty much screwed.

Ian, as an alliance, will you give me a few days (til the 27th if possible)? I have explained in another thread why I have to go on protection for a few days. I will be on occasionally, but my family is more important than a game (sorry if that offends anyone). At that time, I might have a few more answers for you since you've had months and I've had less than a week Wink

I'm asking for 4-5 days. You've waited this long to crush us (grin), a few more days won't make us that much stronger! :p

The ball is in WR's court. I accept that. I don't take this lightly, please understand that. I'm still waiting for some responses from in-game mails sent yesterday and the day before. If I don't get those responses within the next day or so, something drastic will have to happen and that'd suck. (Sorry, I've tried to be really G or at least PG, but I can't think of a more apt word)

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Post by Special Agent 47 Thu Dec 24, 2009 5:12 am

Kismet, I don't think there is much to a "peace treaty". it simple. NO attacks other then farming or raiding are allowed. Ingame that's all a peace treaty is.

We follow our own "3 tier farming system" and you follow your "system"(forgot its official name). Any breaches will be handled as they were before, not an issue.

Negotiation with anyone other then TIE have no bearing on us. I do not want to be rude or gruff but we will not wait for days or weeks while you negotiate with 3rd parties. TIE and WR are on the brink of War, You might want to expedite that to the front of the line maybe?

As for a cease fire, I'll let Ian make the official statement, but you should expect a NO. The only time anything has happened is when WR was under pressure, and every time we slacked off or backed off we got blindsided and sorry but it won't happen again. We will not lose another member because we chose once again to back down from someone who spits in our face every time we let them up. That said, I am not speaking for TIE, Ian may agree to it, I'm just expressing my opinion of what the answer will be.

Your language is fine for open forums, only Kenzu seems to not have the self control to not pollute it.

If you need the 3 or 4 days then I think you should send an alliance wide order to go on protection for 4 days, or how ever much time you have. That's the only guarantee of no attacks that you have.

Not trying to be rude or blunt, just honest.
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Post by Universe Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:03 am

I like you, Kismet.
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Post by Vesper Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:04 am

okay, just random thoughts for now.

idea 1, Kenzu leaves WR and he is dealt with but saves his alliance from destruction. (is the leader willing to take one for the team?)
idea 2, kenzu gives a nice long list of people that are threats to TIE so they can be massed avoiding the smaller members that want nothing to do with the war. (is the leader willing to rat out his alliance members to save his own skin?)
idea 3, members of WR that dont want war can leave and form their own alliance. (will passive members of WR rise up and take the situation into their own hands and realize its time to move on?)

those are possible solutions
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Post by Kismet Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:13 am

Special Agent 47 wrote:Kismet, I don't think there is much to a "peace treaty". it simple. NO attacks other then farming or raiding are allowed. Ingame that's all a peace treaty is.

We follow our own "3 tier farming system" and you follow your "system"(forgot its official name). Any breaches will be handled as they were before, not an issue.

Negotiation with anyone other then TIE have no bearing on us. I do not want to be rude or gruff but we will not wait for days or weeks while you negotiate with 3rd parties. TIE and WR are on the brink of War, You might want to expedite that to the front of the line maybe?

As for a cease fire, I'll let Ian make the official statement, but you should expect a NO. The only time anything has happened is when WR was under pressure, and every time we slacked off or backed off we got blindsided and sorry but it won't happen again. We will not lose another member because we chose once again to back down from someone who spits in our face every time we let them up. That said, I am not speaking for TIE, Ian may agree to it, I'm just expressing my opinion of what the answer will be.

Your language is fine for open forums, only Kenzu seems to not have the self control to not pollute it.

If you need the 3 or 4 days then I think you should send an alliance wide order to go on protection for 4 days, or how ever much time you have. That's the only guarantee of no attacks that you have.

Not trying to be rude or blunt, just honest.

Actually, there are a couple of points I'd like within a peace treaty with TIE that Ian would probably like Wink

We've implemented the 3 tier system as well (as I have stated a few posts ago), so that's our farming policy.

I've made very clear to all members of WR that if they go against the farming policy, they'll answer to me. Not Kenzu, but me; as I was the one to draw the line in the sand with WR on that policy; I will make everyone responsible for it. Since it's new to our members, I've gotten a lot of questions from them about it. That's positive in my opinion. They're willing to make the change and to make it quickly.

The "no attacks" wouldn't be farming missions, but massing players. A cease-fire would be for when we would start negotiations, not right now.

I wouldn't fully consider WR under pressure and trying to find a way to escape it. You also have to remember you're not dealing with Kenzu right now, but me Smile Right now, I'm a little irritable because I woke up after 3 hours sleep with the hiccups and those gave me a serious headache. If I appear to be short, apologies. I *hate* headaches and cannot remember hiccups giving me one before. That was 2 hours ago *sigh*

SA47 wrote:As for a cease fire, I'll let Ian make the official statement, but you should expect a NO. The only time anything has happened is when WR was under pressure, and every time we slacked off or backed off we got blindsided and sorry but it won't happen again. We will not lose another member because we chose once again to back down from someone who spits in our face every time we let them up. That said, I am not speaking for TIE, Ian may agree to it, I'm just expressing my opinion of what the answer will be.

This I specifically want to answer. I've already stated that I don't believe we're under pressure. Since we're not massing each other, there isn't a slacking or backing off. Being blindsided has become normal to me in the last few days. I realize just how little has been passed on to me or just letting me know about something. You're dealing with me. I do compromise, as I've stated before, but I won't be walked on. I also don't put people in a position of trusting me then stab them (or spit in their face). As Ian and your views have been extremely similar on here, I have no doubt you're right if I were asking for a cease-fire *right now*.

(Backstory coming up!)
Spoiler:

When I say situations change, I mean things like trust, loyalties (because of trust or other disagreements on policy), and/or a new person thrown into the mix. Because of the backstory above, I'm hoping you understand why I'm not just telling Kenzu to "get out." He has helped WR quite a bit, perhaps not on the diplomatic front, but individual members have been helped. Others have been given chances they wouldn't have normally gotten. Maybe because of that and a general trusting nature of his own members, we allowed a spy into our leadership who gave out specifics on our alliance makeup, leadership, inactives (which are also being taken care of within the next day or so). Inactivity is something that will be an ongoing issue for everyone. Real life pops up, people get bored, people decide "enough is enough." So it's ongoing. These aren't the same people from months ago; those people were removed at the time. People removed in this way are always welcomed back if they come back.

As I stated in another post, there are some hard choices coming up for WR. Things are going to change, that much I can promise. I may not be the most popular player nor the most respected. Sometimes it might seem I go at things with an Iron Fist. That definitely doesn't win me any brownie points. Tough love is never easy! WR has to decide what's best for WR. What direction we're going to be taking, what our immediate and long term goals are. Who we trust and who we don't.

Secret plans & sneak attacks. I understand the need for some secrecy (spies!). I have absolutely no intentions on going back on anything I've said (even though it seems like I'm rambling, in my head it all makes sense right now - could be due to the headache though). I refuse to work out peace and have that destroyed because of a sneak attack or plan of which I'm left without any knowledge. That'll bring about more consequences than I think most will want. Not just retaliation from whomever is massed, but my own wrath. I'm stating this so it's public knowledge and no one can say I haven't given fair warning.

@Universe: Thanks Wink Considering the bah humbug attitude you've been giving, that's a high compliment! Smile

Sorry for the rambling. I did make a few points in there. I'm sure it'll be quoted soon so it can't be changed (I wouldn't anyway unless I added - and then I put [edit:]) - I just hope people realize it's a whole different person from the one you've been dealing with Smile

@Vesper: I've seen these points before. If, and I doubt it'd happen, Kenzu were to rat out members, I'll leave WR immediately. Right now I can think of only a handful of people who would be threats to TIE if that many. He'd be turning not only on WR members, but friends... to do that would also force a number of people out of WR for the same reason I'd leave. As I said, some very hard choices are coming up for WR - things that will be taking place within the next week if not the next few days. If you guys could be a tad patient on that, you might find you like the outcome, whichever way it comes (I see only a couple of realistic choices).

I'm not going to go into specifics on this forum. You're welcome to message me in-game concerning it, but I would prefer MSN for such things (faster communications). I also would prefer only Ian or someone who helps shape policy for TIE to be involved in that and again, I'd still be somewhat vague since nothing is concrete as of yet.

Happy Holidays. Blessed be.


[edit: we finally made it to page 30........ ugh]


Last edited by Kismet on Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:14 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : addition)

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Post by Hai-Shulud Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:22 pm

Kismet wrote:Sometimes it might seem I go at things with an Iron Fist. That definitely doesn't win me any brownie points.

Eughh did you just say Iron Fist? Shocked Well thats gonna make some of us smile Razz

On a serious note (sorry for breaking the silence treatment Ian) its nice to finally be talking to someone with a good grasp of events. Id like to talk to you on msn if possible, im not in charge of negotiations or resolving this- thats Vesper and SA47 - but i would like you to clarify some things for me if you find the time. Obviously not over today or tomorrow or even the day after but sometime soon.
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Post by Kismet Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:25 pm

Hai-Shulud wrote:
Kismet wrote:Sometimes it might seem I go at things with an Iron Fist. That definitely doesn't win me any brownie points.

Eughh did you just say Iron Fist? Shocked Well thats gonna make some of us smile Razz

On a serious note (sorry for breaking the silence treatment Ian) its nice to finally be talking to someone with a good grasp of events. Id like to talk to you on msn if possible, im not in charge of negotiations or resolving this- thats Vesper and SA47 - but i would like you to clarify some things for me if you find the time. Obviously not over today or tomorrow or even the day after but sometime soon.


sexybabe6671@hotmail.com - be sure to tell me who you are when adding please Smile I'm always online, always set away, just msg, if I'm here, I'll respond Smile

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Post by Starryager Thu Dec 24, 2009 5:44 pm

Sexy. Very Happy I like sexy girls.

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Post by Special Agent 47 Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:13 pm

Kismet wrote:
SA47 wrote:As for a cease fire, I'll let Ian make the official statement, but you should expect a NO. The only time anything has happened is when WR was under pressure, and every time we slacked off or backed off we got blindsided and sorry but it won't happen again. We will not lose another member because we chose once again to back down from someone who spits in our face every time we let them up. That said, I am not speaking for TIE, Ian may agree to it, I'm just expressing my opinion of what the answer will be.

This I specifically want to answer. I've already stated that I don't believe we're under pressure. Since we're not massing each other, there isn't a slacking or backing off. Being blindsided has become normal to me in the last few days. I realize just how little has been passed on to me or just letting me know about something. You're dealing with me. I do compromise, as I've stated before, but I won't be walked on. I also don't put people in a position of trusting me then stab them (or spit in their face). As Ian and your views have been extremely similar on here, I have no doubt you're right if I were asking for a cease-fire *right now*.

Let me explain very clearly what I mean when I say Pressure. WR members have been massed. Because of this there has been a significant increase of diplomatic talk that are actually working. Not like the last 3 months of talking to the fence post named Kenzu. More will be massed. The longer this draggs out, the more accounts will fall. Be it WR accounts, or TIE account. Fact is more are going to feel the "pressure".

Don't take this as a threat, it is not meant as one. I have not been on the military front against WR yet. I have been more a financial adviser. Unfortunately My patience is at an end. I have been spat on for the last time. I have turned the other cheek and now that both have been bruised by Kenzu I will turn no more. If I do not see true progress, or some resolve, them I too will enter the military front and assist in applying "pressure" on WR to advance the resolution of the issues.
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Post by Kismet Fri Dec 25, 2009 6:41 am

Special Agent 47 wrote:
Kismet wrote:
SA47 wrote:As for a cease fire, I'll let Ian make the official statement, but you should expect a NO. The only time anything has happened is when WR was under pressure, and every time we slacked off or backed off we got blindsided and sorry but it won't happen again. We will not lose another member because we chose once again to back down from someone who spits in our face every time we let them up. That said, I am not speaking for TIE, Ian may agree to it, I'm just expressing my opinion of what the answer will be.

This I specifically want to answer. I've already stated that I don't believe we're under pressure. Since we're not massing each other, there isn't a slacking or backing off. Being blindsided has become normal to me in the last few days. I realize just how little has been passed on to me or just letting me know about something. You're dealing with me. I do compromise, as I've stated before, but I won't be walked on. I also don't put people in a position of trusting me then stab them (or spit in their face). As Ian and your views have been extremely similar on here, I have no doubt you're right if I were asking for a cease-fire *right now*.

Let me explain very clearly what I mean when I say Pressure. WR members have been massed. Because of this there has been a significant increase of diplomatic talk that are actually working. Not like the last 3 months of talking to the fence post named Kenzu. More will be massed. The longer this draggs out, the more accounts will fall. Be it WR accounts, or TIE account. Fact is more are going to feel the "pressure".

Don't take this as a threat, it is not meant as one. I have not been on the military front against WR yet. I have been more a financial adviser. Unfortunately My patience is at an end. I have been spat on for the last time. I have turned the other cheek and now that both have been bruised by Kenzu I will turn no more. If I do not see true progress, or some resolve, them I too will enter the military front and assist in applying "pressure" on WR to advance the resolution of the issues.

Much better explanation Smile As I've asked, some resolution does take a bit of time.... I didn't ask for long (a week?)... that's nothing compared to the months that everything else has been going on

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Post by Special Agent 47 Fri Dec 25, 2009 2:47 pm

Kismet wrote:
Much better explanation Smile As I've asked, some resolution does take a bit of time.... I didn't ask for long (a week?)... that's nothing compared to the months that everything else has been going on

You just said a mouth full, I hope you realize that. We asked for weeks and got NOTHING from you. Yet you expect us to comply with you "quick, fast, and in a hurry".

Point blank Kismet. What happens, happens. I told you, and I meant it, the long this drags on the more accounts will fall. Be it WR accounts, or be it TIE accounts. Nothing more, and nothing less.

I am glad you are feeling better. I didn't know you were in the hospital. It does infuriate me tho, to know Kenzu used you and your name as a delay tactic knowing you could not for fill your role as the diplomat he said you would be.

Not trying to be rude or an ass, but you don't have the right nor the room to ask for "Time", yet alone a week. You can thank Kenzu for that.
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Post by GeIveI2aL Sat Dec 26, 2009 7:19 pm

Care and patience, though 'Time is not WR friend' at this point.

We ask if you can reply ''quick, fast and in a hurry'' (as you put it SA-47) but I dont expect things to be rapidly sorted out. (But hopefully!)

TIE consider themselves abused for months by actions NEITHER me or Kismet took and now the repreccusions of those actions come to haunt WR as a whole.

WR is getting battered and bruised and so SA-47 says (Am not doubting) will get worse IF MORE time is taken, hence the aim to clear up things up quickly and effectively for BOTH sides.

Kismet probally is, I know am aware, that things cant just go and disappear.
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Post by ian Sat Dec 26, 2009 7:25 pm

GeIveI2aL wrote:WR is getting battered and bruised and so SA-47 says (Am not doubting) will get worse IF MORE time is taken, hence the aim to clear up things up quickly and effectively for BOTH sides.

Kismet probally is, I know am aware, that things cant just go and disappear.

Lol, to my knowledge about 3 TIE players at maximum have actually conducted "heavy" (i.e. assaults) massing actions - with a handful of others then conducting support roles (mopping up left over supers, assassins etc...). All of these are barely coordinated by volunteers, and the vast majority of TIE (Over 80% of the members) haven't yet got involved *at all*.

So... SA47 is very much correct that things will get a LOT worse the more time things take - one reason being that so far The Imperium Empire has not yet mobilised to end this with World Republic - and if we do so (which we will *eventually* do if diplomacy seems to be making no progress) the number of players, and the amount of resources being utilised to attack World Republic will increase by a multiple of several magnitudes/ dozens over what is currently happening.
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Post by Special Agent 47 Sat Dec 26, 2009 9:17 pm

GeIveI2aL wrote:TIE consider themselves abused for months by actions NEITHER me or Kismet took and now the repreccusions of those actions come to haunt WR as a whole.

Well said.

Now what will WR do about it?
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Post by ian Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:39 am

I think we are all growing tired of this endless discussion.

World Republic - you need to get together, figure out what you want... and fast. Its that simple.
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Post by ian Sun Dec 27, 2009 5:11 pm

anyone from WR out there?
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Post by GeIveI2aL Sun Dec 27, 2009 6:29 pm

Several Steps are being taken within WR right now, unless you have a fancy spy... I aint going to divulge.

What the aim is - Is trying to reduce and IF we can then stop the damage as soon as we can.

So WR is doing something, as quickly as we can but as I've said previously, time is not WR's friend right now.

Am sure things will come to light, sooner rather then later.
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Post by Special Agent 47 Sun Dec 27, 2009 7:20 pm

GeIveI2aL wrote:Several Steps are being taken within WR right now, unless you have a fancy spy... I aint going to divulge.

What the aim is - Is trying to reduce and IF we can then stop the damage as soon as we can.

So WR is doing something, as quickly as we can but as I've said previously, time is not WR's friend right now.

Am sure things will come to light, sooner rather then later.

Good luck to you then, and Godz speed.



Just a point of interest, I have removed myself from negotiations at the request of the WR diplomats in hopes of streamlining the talks and causing less confusion as there was some coming from me and Ian not saying the same thing on a few points.
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