Black Market + Server-wide judgement day

lol, was just chatting with a couple of mates... and we had a idea which would be a unique way of giving the smaller guys a chance to catch up.

Basically - have it so there is a ingame black market on Aderan Wars - which offers unique weapons, short-term capabilities (bonuses) etc... which are solely black market related i.e. can't be domestically researched, or developed, by players.

Here's the catch though (and would be a fun twist to the game) - the black market is ran by privateers, arms dealers etc... - so basically criminal enterprise. You could have affects of the black markets growth impacting upon all players - just impacting upon the larger members more. I.e. the more players and the more frequent players interact with the Black Market, the richer and more powerful the criminal gangs become - resulting in abductions from players realms (reduced population growth), corruption (reduced income), sabotage (weapons damaged) etc... - basically done by the game against all players - but to varying levels.

It would in the future open up possibilities unseen on other games - such as the impact of a criminal black market impacting players to enough of an extent for groups of players to make treaties and agreements of not using the black market (thus missing all the different bonuses and advantages offerred by it) in an attempt to curve/ reduce the strength of the black market. On the other hand - there will always be players who would use the black market to their advantage i.e. using the different traits and advantages offerred from it - as well as potentially making it their objective to strength the black market to further impact others more.

Finally - if you really wanted to add a fun twist to the game - make it so the black market slowly builds up to something - a judgement day. Have it where the Black Market uses some of its profits to research a forbidden technology (with a % counter showing the progress towards 100% if the black market is growing due to player interaction - or decrease to it if the black market reduces due to less player interaction with it) - when the research into that forbidden technology is done... something happens i.e. the creation of artificial life - resulting in several strong "bot" accounts (or admin controlled accounts lol) being formed and consequently trying to wipe humanity out - starting with the larger accounts, irrespective of alliances etc... - of course you d need to make sure they are 100% destroyable... but it would add a new elemant to the game for EVERYONE to consider/ interact with.

Artificial intelligeance (judgement day)

If you did run with the "A.I going active once research is completed" theme, you could have the A.I accounts as 100% army size - made of unique units i.e. cyborgs with built in weapons (so no armoury, no workers, miners, or anything else) - with the cyborg units being 3 - 4 times stronger than supers. The cyborg armies would regenerate based on farming kuwal (and using it to purchase new components from the black market to build more units) and raiding (turning humans into cyborgs ) - they d be waging war against all the players... focusing mainly on the larger one's (but occassionally farming/ raiding smaller players) etc...

You could even add in a mini-story to it to give the game some depth i.e. the whole story of Aderan Wars is 4 factions, in the same federation, fighting it out to get back military experience and develop new military doctrines to defend the federation against potential outside threats - such as a cyborg invasion . The A.I army would be killable... but wouldn't be easy due to its initial starting size, ability to regenerate etc...

Another alternative could be a zombie apocalpyse resulting from black market research into banned biological weapons - and then loosing control

Or... you could have the black market developing over time - with at the end of each tech tree (rate of research based on use by players) some huge event happening (i.e. cyborg invasion, zombie apocalpse)... then the next tech tree commences, with new black-market unique weapons, bonuses, techs becoming available. The story driven events would get stronger over time - reflecting the growth of the server's members.

It would just add a unique feel to the game

Not entirely sure what people will think of this idea lol

i think a more detailed explanation is required ian for it to make sense and to fit in the the servers conditions.
Dont get off track with zombies uve been playing gow2 and cod5 too much <_<

Jon wrote:i think a more detailed explanation is required ian for it to make sense and to fit in the the servers conditions.
Dont get off track with zombies uve been playing gow2 and cod5 too much <_<

grr lol

Aderan Wars theme = big federation, peaceful for 1000's of years. Realises its in no position for a fight (outofdate weapons, technologies, tactics etc,...) - so sets aside area of space to play wargames = aderan wars.

Black Market = linked directly to interaction with it - the more its used by players to gain an edge, the cheaper the benefits are from it. The more its used = criminals running it get richer = more corruption, abduction, sabotage, plundering etc... of players on Aderan Wars - with the criminals focusing more on the richer (larger) realms first.

Benefits: Special weapons, bonuses (increased birthrate), drugs for the workers/ miners (increased income), cyborg components for supers (harder to kill/ more powerful etc...)

To reduce the black markets impact = use it less. Potentially results in treaties etc.. between players who are tired of the adverse effects from the black market growing. Others will however use it to gain advantage.

The criminals running the black market, use some of the profits gained from selling to players to slowly research new techs - with over time (as the research builds up in terms of higher %) new bonuses, weapons etc.. become available for players to use. If the black market is used less... it can also drop in its research achieved (i.e. can't afford to pay for the necessary skilled specialists to maintain the knowledge base and techs available etc...).

With each tech tree being completed (hitting 100%) some story-driven event happens... whether its A.I being created and trying to wipe the federation out, zombie apocalpyse (illegal biological research), alien invasion or whatever....

These events would most likely be featured in the form of bots i.e. cyborg accounts made 100% of killable units. Each cyborg = 3 - 4 times more powerful than supers, incorporated weapons etc... The bots raid/ farm players - and actively mass the larger targets. Kuwal gained, or UU raided = used to purchase more cyborgs... this would be their only means of growth.... and they could be wiped out completely (though prefarably requiring a coalition effort of a reasonable chunk of players lol)... after this you could have mini-cyborg outbreaks etc.. if you wanted.

Story driven events would serve to add more depth to the game, liven it up, act as a means of helping smaller players catch up - and generally add a fun twist to things.

There would be multiple Black Market research tree's - at the end of each an story-based event... which after the event has been featured, it means spontaneous smaller scale versions of that event randomly happen on Aderan Wars from then onwards. Research of the tech tree would be based on use of it by players... so theoritically it would be possible to reverse the black market - preventing the events happening - or alternatively if the player base gets too greedy, we could end up being hit by first one event - then when still dealing with one event i.e. cyborg invasion, the tech tree gets fully researched again (adding yet more Black Market benefits, but also disadvantages) - another event happens i.e. zombie apocalpyse (1 - 3% of the servers daily unit production gets turned into undead hell bent on eating everyone's stat forces or something - i dunno lol)

Would just add a new aspect to the game

my biggest problem is any "negative" should effect ALL accounts equally. No offense but I am SICK TO DEATH of seeing long term players punished for the new guy. I am SICK TO DEATH of seeing account constantly selling UU to stay "small" and reap the benifits of all the "protections" on small accounts.

New/smaller accounts get a fine share of benifits to help them, from extra resources above "big" accounts for voting to the administrative fees the "big" boys have to pay. To add a "destroy BIG accounts randomly" for kicks, well I have no intrest in it myself.

As I said no offense and nothing personal but SGW players know what im talking about.

Nomad wrote:my biggest problem is any "negative" should effect ALL accounts equally. No offense but I am SICK TO DEATH of seeing long term players punished for the new guy. I am SICK TO DEATH of seeing account constantly selling UU to stay "small" and reap the benifits of all the "protections" on small accounts.

New/smaller accounts get a fine share of benifits to help them, from extra resources above "big" accounts for voting to the administrative fees the "big" boys have to pay. To add a "destroy BIG accounts randomly" for kicks, well I have no intrest in it myself.

As I said no offense and nothing personal but SGW players know what im talking about.

lol - thats a good point.

How about a simple bot script for the A.I?

I.e have the "cyborgs" or whatever basically be unique accounts. They d have no weapons/ armour - but their cyborg units would generate their own power - and be 3 - 4 times more powerful than normal supers. The account would be 100% made of killable units (prefarably able to be used in both defence and attack) - so they d be able to be wiped out by players - which since they d have no weapons, when dealing solely with A.I accounts maybe replace the sabb function (literally just for A.I - for normal players it would be sabb lol) to kill a set amount of units per hit or something? i.e. using normal functions their losses would be based on % of total units they have... so for the bulk of attacks against them they d loose a lot - but eventually as their total drops (thus the amount killed based on % decreases) it would become more and more costly to kill them (and impossible to fully kill them!) - hence the need for a "kill XXX amount" function to be added for these specific accounts - which can be used to inflict damage once the % of total units killed issue arises.

I ve never dealt with auto-farm/ auto-raid scripts, but i m assuming you d have to input a minimum variable to farm for? Why not do the same for any A.I bot? In addittion, for massing - even though there are many other options for massing on here, than other games - you could just use the good old fashioned "multiple attack" method to eventually break weapons, and kill units. I m guessing you could also enter in a minimum variable for the bot to cease attacking in terms of enemy units killed?

Since the amount of units a person looses per hit is based on % of total defence units someone has, then *i think* that would mean basically the larger a person is, the more hits it would take to drop their units below the "minimum kill variable" - thus more weapon damage due to more hits? So potentially a larger army size would require the bot to hit them more times to drop them below the minimum variable - potentially resulting in their weapons being broken, and loosing a lot more units. Smaller defence people = would take far less hits to knock them down below the minimum kill variable... thus they d be less affected, and potentially still have their weapons intact.

If this was the case.. you could rather than specifically targetting the larger players - simply set the relevant kill variables, and probably farm/ raid variables - give them a starting point, and then watch the fireworks happen lol.

Sabbing would probably be a bit more complicated, but the same principle about defenders losses based on % of weapons would be the same factor - as would all the other aspects of the game... only thing is i have no idea how the bots would go about figuring out how much of what to send etc... lol

All kuwal or UU it raids, could be used to "purchase" cyborg units of the black market to replace its losses - but as said above.. it could be completely wiped out for good (though smaller weaker outbreaks would happen from time to time once the "main" event had happened - which if left unchallenged could potentially grow a lot stronger!)

But... it wouldn't have to target just the larger players (it would be best if it started on a well thought out place whether strongest or largest etc... though lol) if based on a minimum variable, or be all that difficult to code? - not that i know anything about it, so could be wrong. lol

Edit: You could also have some benefit gained from killing cyborb troops i.e. gain a certain amount of kuwal back per cyborg super killed -due to cyborg components being recyled or something lol - so potentially well armed, well thought out players could go cyborg hunting to make a profit

ok read sorta through everything. point of fact remaining you either talked to my brother or you see into future
at least for a part of the suggestion involving the ai accounts.

about the cyborgs didn't that suggestion pop up in sgw or dune?
never really liked it lol

@ ian: the official theme/storyline changed a bit as to why there are wars, just didn't have time to write up the RP part

@ nomad: selling uu's has strong disadvantages so people only do it for as long as the investment into raw up is better than into uu's. If you sell units it's harder to get the new weapons, spy skills, etc. And although farming and raiding can make a nice extra income you will need a good income of your own to keep up with everyone else in the long term
Meaning it's in everyone's interest to become big

Admin wrote:ok read sorta through everything. point of fact remaining you either talked to my brother or you see into future
at least for a part of the suggestion involving the ai accounts.

about the cyborgs didn't that suggestion pop up in sgw or dune?
never really liked it lol

@ ian: the official theme/storyline changed a bit as to why there are wars, just didn't have time to write up the RP part

@ nomad: selling uu's has strong disadvantages so people only do it for as long as the investment into raw up is better than into uu's. If you sell units it's harder to get the new weapons, spy skills, etc. And although farming and raiding can make a nice extra income you will need a good income of your own to keep up with everyone else in the long term
Meaning it's in everyone's interest to become big

He sees into the future, because I didn't tell him anything.

We already have a way of kicking big accounts in the nads. It's the AE, and it's enough.

Sandwalker wrote:We already have a way of kicking big accounts in the nads. It's the AE, and it's enough.

actually it isn't. because atm it's impossible for a new account catch up with an old one unless the old one gets into wars.

Aditionally AE limit is now at around 50%, I considered dropping it to 40-35% but that's gonna be a long discussion first

Admin wrote:

Sandwalker wrote:We already have a way of kicking big accounts in the nads. It's the AE, and it's enough.

actually it isn't. because atm it's impossible for a new account catch up with an old one unless the old one gets into wars.

Aditionally AE limit is now at around 50%, I considered dropping it to 40-35% but that's gonna be a long discussion first

A new active account shouldn't be able to catch up to an old active account.

Wars will happen, they're inevitable. They don't happen right now because the player base is low and the game is new.

A hyper active new account will catch up to an old moderately active account. But why should it catch up when their activity is the same ? Plus if and when you actually introduce that SP trade thing, new accounts will catch up a little faster and old accounts will have an incentive to get into wars, longer, more damaging wars.

Well if smaller Players are active and work together in the Alliance they are in then there will be a chance to get bigger faster. If a Player works on his account you can grow very fast. Not as much as in Games where you pay to grow :-), but with useing a good strategy.

I believe anything added into the game right now would hurt the game in a long run. I still believe the Player base needs to grow towards 1k to 2k Players before we do anything that has a major change to the game. In the long run that should help more than anything changed right now.

Now lets see how many People post saying nah nope your wrong

LOL

Magnus wrote:Well if smaller Players are active and work together in the Alliance they are in then there will be a chance to get bigger faster. If a Player works on his account you can grow very fast. Not as much as in Games where you pay to grow :-), but with useing a good strategy.

I believe anything added into the game right now would hurt the game in a long run. I still believe the Player base needs to grow towards 1k to 2k Players before we do anything that has a major change to the game. In the long run that should help more than anything changed right now.

Now lets see how many People post saying nah nope your wrong

LOL

lol, with a bit of luck we can be a practical example of the fact small accounts can catch up and exceed some of the larger accounts.

As for changes to the game... admins gonna be busy untill the end of June anyway i think he said? So thats another month or 2 before any major updates are even starting to be thought about - and potentially a while after that before any are implemented. So in the mean time... its basically an opportunity for Aderans memberbase to suggest some potential updates, think them through, evaluate the pro's and con's etc... - so when the time comes, hopefully there will be some neat idea's to be given serious thought to adding to Aderan to make the game even more better/ unique than what is already is vs. the usual "copy and paste" versions of other games which are similar in nature to one another and basically poor copies i.e SGW, Dune etc... lol

actually AE limit is 40% not 50%
for anyone that actually cares

Admin wrote:actually AE limit is 40% not 50%
for anyone that actually cares

of course we care ...

Of course the 40% is on paper ...... I doubt someone will get to about 20x average army very soon

rflash wrote:Of course the 40% is on paper ...... I doubt someone will get to about 20x average army very soon

well technically 40% is the limit meaning someone needs to have an infinite army size to actually get it

I love Ian's Idea! I think this zombie/cyborg mega bot would really M Night Shamalan This game up!


And for those of you that do not understand this, it means add a twist!

stream of consciousness:
What if "black market" involvement by players showed up in a spyable stat? The black market needs to be used to get stronger/stay relevant, but a penalty is that users that dabble too much in the black market start showing up as privateers (or however you want to "mark" black market frequenters). If you only use moderately, you can stay below the radar. But, if you start using too much too frequently, you show up with a "mark". This way, if factions want to fight the strength of whatever apocalyptic event may happen with a strong black market (cyborgs, or maybe proportional destruction to farmers inversely proportional to your "mark meter" stat), players can gang up on players with "marks". Maybe also spyable is how recent your most recent "black market" involvement was.