Re: World Republic attack on a Commonwealth member.

Survivor · by Survivor on Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:27 am

Now, Now, 1b is nothing compared to total annihilation don't you think?
plus why don't you try coming up with such an ultimatum. You'll realize what stress is.

I might add that this issue is not only because of stress. If you go through all of the comments here thoroughly you'll know what I mean

raynar · by raynar on Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:54 am

I personally was not aware of the actions of my alliance. I don't use the forums much as per other obligations in my life. So the only info I received about my alliance was through in game e-mails from the HC. However, after reading this post, I have come to the conclusion that WR HC is cowardly and I do not wish to remain a part of that alliance. Therefore I have left WR. Good luck to you in your upcoming war.

Wow · by Osyndicate on Sun Sep 20, 2009 7:44 am

Although I will be destroyed in the upcoming attack upon all WR members for what we (Which is much to general to even be considered as a we) have done. I am not going to abandon the alliance that took me in and taught me all the things I value as an aderan wars member. I can only pray that this will be resolved before doomsday.

Admin · by Admin on Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:07 am

First warning given to jerry blazicka

Kenzu · by Kenzu on Sun Sep 20, 2009 9:25 am

ian wrote:
A commonwealth member - space2050 - attacked 3cats4me for Kuwal

He responded by declaring war on Space2050, attempted to spy him, and then attempting to sabotage him:

[19 Sep] 16:44 3cats4me Sabotage Mission Failed 26 details

You realise that 3cats4me is a new player of aderan wars.
3cats4me
rank 255
population 3,604

Space2050
rank 47
pop 490,061

so basically you are angry at our member, who has been attacked by YOUR member and hasn't dealt NO DAMAGE AT ALL to your member.

Space2050 · by Space2050 on Sun Sep 20, 2009 9:41 am

Well, the first thing 3cats4me did was declare war, fail at spying, then attempt to sabotage me. And yes, it was for a fair farming attack by me. But..., the main issue with that is the sabotages. If any sabotage attempts had succeeded, the damages would have far exceeded the Kuwal stolen. His reaction to a regular farming attack is way out of proportion, and he is only one member out of many WR members who have reacted similarly. To add to that, his first message to me is clearly a threat. While the threat doesn't seem to hold much danger, that doesn't change the fact that he was meaning to sabotage my account when he clicked sabotage.

People don't tend to just randomly sabotage people on a daily basis. Sure they may farm or raid people, but sabbing isn't the common approach.

slambot#4 · by slambot#4 on Sun Sep 20, 2009 9:53 am

yet again, he wasn't successful, it could be the fact that the army sizes are over 100x different... as a new guy, he had a good amount taken from him and no doubt figured he'd try and fight back... foolish... but its what they do. As for wanting money for writing an ultimatum, you brought that upon your self, if I wrote a huge rant on why i didn't like the company or some other alliance, who's going to pay me? No one! If your staying up at 2 am, yet again, voluntary. Few others would bother with such reactions, and even fewer would expect to gain money from it. Army that you attacked that's 100x smaller then you causing stress? I hope your ready for the real world

Hai-Shulud · by Hai-Shulud on Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:38 am

Im sorry some of my word choices were obviously bad - I mentioned "2am" because that the i play these games due to "real world" taking up the rest of my time. So i guess what i wanted to say is - The last thing i want during my limited time online is to deal with WR and their inability to control any of their members large or small. So Slambot if you want to make any more smart-arse comments feel free but then again WR seems to have an ability to rile other alliances and im more than happy to respond.

I also think there are some very confused people here - No sane person would issue on ultimatum based solely on this event. However WR was so close to the line for us snapping that it took something as trivial ( and i agree that 3cats4me had 0% chance of ever doing any damage ) this to push us over that line. The reason why we are considering this attack even in the slight bit significant is that Kenzu insists on backing up ALL his members. For example Zeroager attempted to mass someone and instead of condoning his actions Kenzu declared his protection on Zeroager against any counter-attack. However in that case the Commonwealth were not involved. This time we are and we have no intention of putting up with that.

So please read the links Ian has provided and i think most people will agree that we are MORE than justified.

Lord Pegasus · by Lord Pegasus on Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:23 am

i couldn't care less what Ian thinks , i still have hate for you and that will not change any time soon but

as i already said in a PM to you Ian ...... hard as it was for me to stay polite i will not attack the alliance but , Do Not expect me to have respect for you

yes i am the type to hold grudges and you are the biggest one on my list , i will stay civil but if i ever get kicked out of WR , then i dont know

doxakk · by doxakk on Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:49 am

Time Attacker Result
[19 Sep] 00:09 Space2050 22,059,924 Kuwal stolen

I was attacked by Space2050 also, I am in WR. It seems he likes to farm WR members and now he wants to appear he is the victim. Your ultimatum means nothing because you are going to attack us anyway. This is what happened with nazi germany giving ultimatums and gaining half of checkoslovakia with the 1938 Munich Agreement and then Austria and then Poland with their allies the Soviets.
Ultimatums are declarations of war, even if you accept, you get attacked anyway because you have shown you cannot face the aggressor. I have been playing the game for a week now, joined sept 12, and the only aggression I have seen on me is from space2050.

p.s. I am not calling anyone a nazi, I am just describing a similar diplomatic situation that the nazi used to their advantage and the allies made a huge mistake.

Sandwalker · by Sandwalker on Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:28 pm

doxakk wrote:Time Attacker Result
[19 Sep] 00:09 Space2050 22,059,924 Kuwal stolen

I was attacked by Space2050 also, I am in WR. It seems he likes to farm WR members and now he wants to appear he is the victim. Your ultimatum means nothing because you are going to attack us anyway. This is what happened with nazi germany giving ultimatums and gaining half of checkoslovakia with the 1938 Munich Agreement and then Austria and then Poland with their allies the Soviets.
Ultimatums are declarations of war, even if you accept, you get attacked anyway because you have shown you cannot face the aggressor. I have been playing the game for a week now, joined sept 12, and the only aggression I have seen on me is from space2050.

p.s. I am not calling anyone a nazi, I am just describing a similar diplomatic situation that the nazi used to their advantage and the allies made a huge mistake.

What you experienced was a profitable farming hit upon yourself. That is completely different from an assassination attempt. Furthermore, let's not forget this is not about 3cats4me's misguided attempt at sabotage. He was merely the last drop. Other, more important issues are the gross of this decision.

And no, WR will not be attacked if it complies with all demands. Our intention is not to destroy you, but to make you change your ways. WR was taking fast steps to becoming a bully, and it is preferable to fix that sooner rather than later. You don't know WR's history in its relations with other alliances. You guys used to threaten players for farming your inactives, saying that they are the alliance's farms. You never did anything about it, hence why you were left alone. That changed though, so "you were left alone" changed as well.

You know, we have a saying over here: "Daca unu-ti spune ca esti beat, e prost. Daca doi iti spun ca esti beat, te duci si te culci." which translates roughly as "If one man tells you you're drunk, he's an idiot. If two men tell you you're drunk, you go home and sleep it off, you're drunk.". WR has been told by the 3 other alliances in the top 4 that it is drunk. Will it stay for the fireworks? Or will it go home and take a nap?

ian · by ian on Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:50 pm

lol, space2050 got a fun message from the catbloke:

"First of all do you mean sabotage or do you mean sab as in hack your account? I don’t even know you and when I saw that you declared war on me it was like… WTH!! I admit I did do attempt to sabotage your def weapons but that was after YOU set WAR with ME! And also I'm P.O because you took 22,000,000+ kuwal from me. Anyway can we (if you do not mind) go to neutral? [world republic] is kinda going to kill you once I get approval. Anyway I don’t know how to hack and I did not (to my knowledge harm you in any way. You have until tomorrow (sep 20) to reply"

As for the rest of World Republic, if your unwilling to comply with the ultimatum - that is to publish a code of conduct/ set of principles for for your members to follow - saying whats accepted, whats not accepted etc... - and whats accepted conduct against World Republic, whats not accepted conduct etc... - and what you intend to do once that code of conduct is breached - then surely does that not tell you something about World Republic?

All The Commonwealth wants is you guys to learn to control yourselves, and to stop throwing your weight around against many other players...the best way is to create something all of WR, and the server as a whole can refer back to when necessary i.e. a code of conduct - which we ll then expect World Republic to stick to.

If World Republic isn't prepared to do something such as that (since it would mean declaring where they stand on many moral issues - thus denying their ability to simply smash little guys whenever they like) - then it simply highlights the failure/ moral ambiguity of World Republic foreign policy - leaving The Commonwealth, along with The Company and The Others... little choice but to attack to end that foreign policy.

Hai-Shulud · by Hai-Shulud on Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:24 pm

There should be NO discussion of why the ultimatum has been issued - Its too late to ask why we have choosen this path, we are convinced we are justified and so please stop questioning our motives over and over again. Why cant someone from the WR HC grow a pair and start talking to us or at least refuse our demands and face the music, at least that way youll regain some respect!

Any individual member of WR who wishes to leave now will be immune, however we really do not wish to see your alliance disband as this will alter the balance of power in the server. So i ask ALL of WR to be loyal and stick by their leaders. However it is also up to ALL of WR to ensure that the actions of you High Command reflect the views and wishes of the majority.

The Commonwealth promises that the most efficient root to server peace will be taken. There are 2 options here - 1) You cooperate and 2) We attack you
The Commonwealth does not seek server domination but BALANCE. For there to be balance there must be sacrifices. It is WR's choice weather as to be the first sacrifice in that cause.
This is NOT personal, it is business

souldog · by souldog on Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:26 pm

Jerry Blazicka wrote:the others commonwealth and the company vs WR. what over a couple mil kuwal.

so now u guys r going on a WR genocide. . the problem was between common wealth and WR . the other 2 alliances should not be involved in this. the common wealth made their claim and you other 2 alliances jumpped in to get some free dough.

we didn't just jumped in. we have been accused of things we haven't done by WR. which in the end after many message kenzu cleared out and said we had nothing to do with it.

i as HC of the company have always watched WR's threads on the forum closely you can find back many messages of me on every topic they made !

We don't like the way WR acts as well. Kenzu is doing things without even thinking a second about it!

and yes it was a newbies actions and he didn't know the game well! but after all WR is showing of with we are the biggest alliance and all that, you can see that here
largest alliance . if that's the way you like the recruit then you have to make your new members clear how the game works and to act smart!
most of them probably join and think "damn i'm in the biggest alliance in this game they can't harm me".

3cats4me couldn't even see his armysize or amount of kuwal out ! 1 good tip to give your new members !

Don't Attack What You Can't See

The Company
High Council Member of Economy and War
Souldog

ian · by ian on Sun Sep 20, 2009 2:47 pm

35hours 25minutes untill the ultimatum expires, and WR's failure to comply with the ultimatum/ demands are deemed a declaration of war by World Republic against The Commonwealth, The Company and The Others.

To clarify exactly what we want:

1.) we want a code of conduct (to give you a idea - The Commonwealth's own one is here: http://aderanwars.forumotion.com/alliance-recruitment-f19/the-commonwealth-t451-30.htm#6878) which sets out World Republic's views/ principles regarding its members and outside members conduct - and what shall and shan't be accepted, and consequences of breach of the conduct.

If World Republic's code of conduct satisfies the main alliances of Aderan Wars (in terms of justice, fairness and general morals) then we shall expect World Republic to abide by it (failure to do so would result in us enforcing it against WR).

2.) We want World Republic to cease immediately any attempts at infiltration with spies of any other alliance, and to cease attempting to set up a surveillance network of the other alliances on Aderan Wars.

3.) We want the names of ALL World Republic operatives in other alliances - coupled with evidence that they are actually operatives (if we don't get any names + evidence of their being operations ... this term will be deemed not being satisfied, and the ultimatum breached) - you may want to consider that between The Commonwealth, The Company and The Others we have a considerable list/ knowledge of World Republic spies operating in our ranks, and other alliances - so if you try to double cross us on this i.e. miss out a operatives name - we ll know, and deem it a breach of the ultimatum, and thus a declaration of war.

4.) We demand World Republic drop all its inactive members - the definition of active being logging in, in the last 36hours.

5.) WR accept that any member of WR who has more resources out in the open than 36 hours worth will be considered no longer protected by WR and so will be open to sabbing and massing to reduce defences and so farming costs - by any outside party/ alliance.

6.) World Republic pay The Commonwealth 1,000,000,000 kuwal for its troubles, and The Company 750,000,000 for their troubles - this 1,750,000,000 thus acting as a compensation to World Republic victims, and acting as a fine on World Republic for previous crimes committed, thereby restoring some justice for their crimes.

Failure to comply with any of the above by the time of the dead-line (2.13 a.m GMT, tuesday the 22nd 2009), will be deemed a declaration of war by World Republic against The Commonwealth, The Company and The Others, and as such a state of hostilities shall exist.

Thats about it i think... did i miss anything out, anyone?